Dropping adv. melee?

[kam!]

Well this isn't technically a suggestion, but more a start of a discussion.
I thinks that the current simple melee (and I guess the general melee of 1.1)
is pretty awesome. So awesome that it could make up melee in general. Well let's face it:
1.2 adv melee sucks, and the current design docs melee sounds awfully slow as well.
I'd go as far to say that any attemp at adv melee (which's goal it is to visualize the shows close-range fights)
will end up slow and horrible. That kind of fighting should be left to console fighters, where
the controls are more fit for it.

Now why do I make this thread?

I want to collect suggestions how to improve the current (simple) melee system so that it's worthy of
being the only melee component of ESF.

I don't know how exactly flying speeds relate to the maximum speed possible, but I'd almost double
the default swopping speed. I know this will make it hrader for total noobs, but in general it will improve the feel of melee.
(IIRC, the speeds in 1.1 were faster in general, and were dropped in 1.2 in favor of transformation speeds).


So well, objections, additions or praise? Post away!

 

[Damaera]

I 100% agree with that statement.I absolutely hated 1.2 Advanced Melee.

Let's just hope it gets improved in 1.3.

 

[Zeonix]

I'm with you 100% with you on the idea that advanced melee is both unnecessary, and would only serve to hinder the game and slow it down, which is something the game definitely does not need.

We already have a base, that base being 1.2. We don't need to go back all the way to 1.0 and 1.1. Some of those concepts are good, but 1.2 is much better game overall. So what can we do elevate ESF above 1.2? What can we do to add depth? I won't get to into it, but I think if we turned ESF into more of a flight sim, minus the sim, and less of a fighting game, we'd have a much more interesting and intense game.

First of all, we should expand upon our current movement system. I don't mean we should add 20 different kinds of swoops either. In my thread, I suggested such things as aerial evasion, where you'd be able to barrel roll to the left or right, effectively removing you from the line of fire. You should be able to evade from a standing position as well, perhaps not a spin maneuver as I suggested, but something that would allow someone who has too little ki to teleport away, but enough ki for a single swoop, making it so that your only course of action isn't to block and press fly so that you drop straight down.

I also suggested we have different fighting styles, which would significantly affect both the way we move, and the way we fight. This suggestion alone would add much needed depth to simple melee. The tackle idea would also fall into the melee department.

I think it's time we stop wasting our time trying to come up with Tenkaichi and Budokai clones, and start working with what we have and what makes ESF unique. It's time to expand on what already exists and add some much needed depth. It's time we start listening to the community's ideas.

 

[kam!]

I think it's time we stop wasting our time trying to come up with Tenkaichi and Budokai clones, and start working with what we have and what makes ESF unique. It's time to expand on what already exists and add some much needed depth. It's time we start listening to the community's ideas.

This is exactly why I posted this. As nice as it seems, ESF will never be exactly like the show, or like a console fighter melee-wise.

 

[)v(ajin Vegetto]

simple melee isnt enough, id prefer more freedom and also enjoy the a punch or kick from a simple click, in that way fights can be played during aerial and on the ground
then the melee should advance from there

 

[Tenzo]

I agree that simple melee is the base off which we should work. Instead of having two systems, we should have one that has multiple options for attack, and seamlessly integrates those options.

Strongly agree!

 

[)v(ajin Vegetto]

Originally Posted by ESFORCES CREATORS
simple melee isnt enough, id prefer more freedom and also enjoy the a punch or kick from a simple click, in that way fights can be played during aerial and on the ground
then the melee should advance from there

Strongly agree!

 

[Snowm@n]

Strongly agree!

Me too.....

 

[Thunder67467]

This may sound a bit odd, I'm not the best of explaining things but I'll give it a try.

I've played this game for about 2 days now, I'd say the melee concept seems very...empty. I mean its true that in DBZ that once they stunned their opponent that they did many different combos...but the fact that I can just rush into someone and do multiple hitting attacks seems very...off in DBZ.
I think the whole combo system should be looked over, I think that if you rush into someone that it should trigger a "Mouse Button Smash" event, Where basically your struggling to fight just to stun them and get the combo that you desire in.
I would also like to think, that more indepth, If your combos hit your target with more then 70% Accuracy (Final blow must hit) That you can give them a KI Blast to the face. Making it seems very DBZish, I'm not trying to knock anyone for their creative works but, I just wanted to add that it would make it more interesting and more of a struggle to actually land combos, with this suggestion in mind it opens up more of a fighting system.
Ahhh and my all time favorite, when two fighters fought each other, I always remember watching the little flashs of white light...I think that would be all in all interesting in that suggestion..Imagine watching in a distance two people duking it out and seeing flashs of light? It would make you feel as if, wow! This is DBZ O_O lol...IMO anyway.
On that note, I also remember at points where Goku for example, fought off more then 1 fighter...So instead of just having the 1 on 1 deal, Make this into a type of brawl. I know this idea of it might seem like "The game would lag" but...The thought of having multiple people to vend off would make it exciting and a challange to turn out to be #1.

I mean I have a world of suggestions for DBZ...but I also need to explore this game a bit more.
All in all, I think melee should just be more depth, then just a few hits and then boom...rinse..wash..repeat

 

[Grega]

No mouse button smash events. I dont wana throw away my mouse cause i ruined its buttons.

 

[Thunder67467]

No mouse button smash events. I dont wana throw away my mouse cause i ruined its buttons.

LoL your a bit aggressive eh , Well maybe an option of some sort, To either have it Keyboard or Mouse...or both, Instead of just pressing random keys on the keyboard, just have a set two keys for the event, Maybe like the Up and Down Arrow? I mean, Since maybe people who would break their mouse might want to instead just press their keyboard keys lol. Its just an suggestion.

 

[Grega]

LoL your a bit aggressive eh , Well maybe an option of some sort, To either have it Keyboard or Mouse...or both, Instead of just pressing random keys on the keyboard, just have a set two keys for the event, Maybe like the Up and Down Arrow? I mean, Since maybe people who would break their mouse might want to instead just press their keyboard keys lol. Its just an suggestion.

Button mash fests are bad for both mouse and keyboard. It doesnt matter how you press. But the fact that it wears down the actuall buttons.

 

[Toxen]

I agree with everything Nixanthros posted above. Hope the devs will as well.

 

[Eacos]

This may sound a bit odd, I'm not the best of explaining things but I'll give it a try.

I've played this game for about 2 days now, I'd say the melee concept seems very...empty. I mean its true that in DBZ that once they stunned their opponent that they did many different combos...but the fact that I can just rush into someone and do multiple hitting attacks seems very...off in DBZ.
I think the whole combo system should be looked over, I think that if you rush into someone that it should trigger a "Mouse Button Smash" event, Where basically your struggling to fight just to stun them and get the combo that you desire in.
I would also like to think, that more indepth, If your combos hit your target with more then 70% Accuracy (Final blow must hit) That you can give them a KI Blast to the face. Making it seems very DBZish, I'm not trying to knock anyone for their creative works but, I just wanted to add that it would make it more interesting and more of a struggle to actually land combos, with this suggestion in mind it opens up more of a fighting system.
Ahhh and my all time favorite, when two fighters fought each other, I always remember watching the little flashs of white light...I think that would be all in all interesting in that suggestion..Imagine watching in a distance two people duking it out and seeing flashs of light? It would make you feel as if, wow! This is DBZ O_O lol...IMO anyway.
On that note, I also remember at points where Goku for example, fought off more then 1 fighter...So instead of just having the 1 on 1 deal, Make this into a type of brawl. I know this idea of it might seem like "The game would lag" but...The thought of having multiple people to vend off would make it exciting and a challange to turn out to be #1.

I mean I have a world of suggestions for DBZ...but I also need to explore this game a bit more.
All in all, I think melee should just be more depth, then just a few hits and then boom...rinse..wash..repeat

And what do you think is being done now?
You might be new in these forums which proves the fact that you probably haven´t read ANY stickies, outlines, or have even taken the time to browse through countless of content-rich threads.
From what you've stated you probably haven't tried out the 1.3 version of the game... I suggest you download the Open Beta to see what changes have been done, browse the forums to see what features will be implemented, and then you can post your opinions and suggestions.

<3

 

[CLASSIFIED]

hehOo no way. You have any idea how boring this would be if the game was all about swoop and hit?
And I'm a player who rarely uses the advanced melee but so glad it's there just to make things go different for once in a while.

Customizing the game to your own needs rather than learn the game the way it is.. isn't the way. Even if I could agree with you that adv. melee isn't as good as the basic IMO I just refuse to go to the old days of 1.1. Besides that gives newbies their own kind of advantage. I see the newbies tend to learn a lot of adv. melee so It was fun to realize that guy I was fighting at least confused me there for a while.
(Yes I'm good also in adv. melee. I think I just mentioned coming from ESF 1.1 so that's about 4 years ago so no newbie just talked to you)

 

[)v(ajin Vegetto]

i say the more melee systems implented the better, will take more time to get used to wich is fun, and will also be fun itself to play with, i still think a punch and a kick should be activated at a click of a button, e.g mouse 1 = punch mouse 2 = kick, then there will be alot more freedom during aerial and ground battles, dmz style or so will kick ass
esf 1.3 ftw

 

[KYnetiK]

majin, you seem to think a game succeeds by flooding it with features. It doesnt work that way. I believe reverting back to alpha is plain retarded (i mean cmon what a waste of time to just drop anything new with melee). I tend to agree with classified on this one.
Also Majin, that melee idea of yours is just too hard to balance with latency issues. I myself have designed a full melee outline similar, but it would be harder to play across pings. Although a working prototype would be fun to test...

 

[)v(ajin Vegetto]

im just saying the more features = the more funner? then you wouldnt have to rely a new beta or so for more gameplay? why drop something when its already there and done wich doesnt need fixing(why fix something that isnt broken) i think just imrpove apon things and add? also its only my opinon how yours is your buisness
anyways im quite curious to see what the dev team and so comes up with theres quite alot of melee suggestions flowing around right about now

 

[KYnetiK]

More features doesnt make things more fun if it unbalances things though, thats the point im trying to make. Less features with high functionality tend to succeed, hence basic melee. The trouble is coming up with something simple and functional which compliments this, although i still believe it can be done. Sorry if it sounds like Im having a go at you, its just my experience with game design.

 

[)v(ajin Vegetto]

who mentioned anything about adding unbalanced features? and i dont think anything already implented is unbalanced but yeah im having fun with the discussion so no worries?