PROPOSAL - ESF Open Beta Distribution method

[Phobius]

and thats where the bittorent idea will fail because once people download their file they will immediately close their bittorent program and go check out the game. Maybe if we setup a private tracker and in order to get the next build from the team you need to have your share ratio of 1.000 to continue to use bit torrent to download the inteam builds.

 

[Spunky]

and thats where the bittorent idea will fail because once people download their file they will immediately close their bittorent program and go check out the game. Maybe if we setup a private tracker and in order to get the next build from the team you need to have your share ratio of 1.000 to continue to use bit torrent to download the inteam builds.

Like I said before, that would be harsh for the community. People just won't seed, and forcing it upon them will only make things worse. Your best option is a direct download from one of the major uploading services.

 

[Zeonix]

I was assuming the entire idea was to set up a private tracker for the community, Spunky. Not to set up a torrent and send it to a torrent site, which could be construed as "approving of illegal content".

I don't know. I don't like taking babysteps so my mind just jumps way ahead.

Owning 1.3 should be considered a privilege and a responsibility. If people don't want to seed, maybe they shouldn't be allowed to obtain the next version. It isn't hard to track their ip addresses. As much as testing 1.3 would be a service to the team, being allowed to play 1.3 is a service to the community. Don't forget that.

On a side-note, my system can barely be considered a mid-level machine, so unless you're using an extremely old pc, there's no reason to complain. Get a better client, stop crying.

 

[Spunky]

Owning 1.3 should be considered a privilege and a responsibility. If people don't want to seed, maybe they shouldn't be allowed to obtain the next version.

You still don't get it. BitTorrent is so unnecessary for releasing a mod. It's not worth to trouble to FORCE the community into seeding, when EVERYONE could be just as happy with a direct download, assuming there are enough mirrors for everyone.

It isn't hard to track their ip addresses.

You lost me there.

As much as testing 1.3 would be a service to the team, being allowed to play 1.3 is a service to the community. Don't forget that.

I understand that, but as I said before, BT is completely unnecessary for a Half-Life mod. If you wanted to do it later, after there are several mirrors from which I can directly download it, I'd be all for it, because it wouldn't be my problem. I'd have my mod, and I'd be happy. And that is what a large number of others would most likely be thinking as well. Bottom line: We can test the mod for the team, and have fun doing it at the same time. Everyone is happy.

On a side-note, my system can barely be considered a mid-level machine, so unless you're using an extremely old pc, there's no reason to complain. Get a better client, stop crying.

Just about every BT client is a memory hog. Hell, I used the most memory-efficient client there was back in the day: BitLord. It didn't have all of the unnecessary crap the other clients had (graphs and whatnot), and yet when I had it running, it slowed down everything else (especially my internet, from having so many clients connected).

Keep in mind, I didn't have the greatest system back then (512MB memory, AMD Sempron 2800+, etc.), so that's why I can say that BitTorrent definately isn't the ideal option for distribution, as I'm sure alot of others would experience the same thing.

 

[Zeonix]

When did I say "BT should be the only way to get 1.3!!"? Oh, that's right I didn't. I was one of the people who said hl2files should be used because it's accessible and fast.

IF YOU'RE GOING TO USE BT, SEED.

See how simple that is?

 

[markg85]

ehm.. to clear things up a bit from my previous post.. it`s not possible to use usenet as a seeder for torrents.. it would be awsome if it could because of the speeds. i was actually trying to say that the esf team could use usenet to distribute the latest builds and that third part sites could than donwload that distribution and re-distribute it the way they want it.. (ftp, http, torrent.... you name it)

 

[Spunky]

When did I say "BT should be the only way to get 1.3!!"? Oh, that's right I didn't. I was one of the people who said hl2files should be used because it's accessible and fast.

IF YOU'RE GOING TO USE BT, SEED.

See how simple that is?

Much better. Why you didn't say that in the first place, I'll never know.

ehm.. to clear things up a bit from my previous post.. it`s not possible to use usenet as a seeder for torrents.. it would be awsome if it could because of the speeds. i was actually trying to say that the esf team could use usenet to distribute the latest builds and that third part sites could than donwload that distribution and re-distribute it the way they want it.. (ftp, http, torrent.... you name it)

Also not a good idea. Mainly because you need to be somewhat of an advanced user just to get started with Usenet. You need a number of programs for downloading, decoding, repairing, extracting, etc. There would be hundreds of help threads every day, titled "HOW DO I USE THIS!?".

 

[john_volkov]

why not use Filefront for uploading it's verry high speed and I'v seen version of esf and other stuff there
this is what it has now
http://browse.files.filefront.com/H...rths+Special+Forces/;155685;/browsefiles.html

 

[Spunky]

why not use Filefront for uploading it's verry high speed and I'v seen version of esf and other stuff there
this is what it has now
http://browse.files.filefront.com/H...rths+Special+Forces/;155685;/browsefiles.html

John, please go read the earlier posts of this thread.

 

[Zeonix]

Much better. Why you didn't say that in the first place, I'll never know.



Also not a good idea. Mainly because you need to be somewhat of an advanced user just to get started with Usenet. You need a number of programs for downloading, decoding, repairing, extracting, etc. There would be hundreds of help threads every day, titled "HOW DO I USE THIS!?".

Probably because I've already said I support using other distribution methods. It's common sense that if you're going to BT, you're going to have to seed, unless you're an *******. That's how BT works. I shouldn't have to explain simple thought processes.

People wouldn't be setting up anything in usenet. It's as viable as any other site.

 

[Sicron]

Ok how about just this:

- ESF world gets the file.
- Set up that SVN server to host the file
- Get a R-a-p-i-d-s-h-a-r-e server (Was this censored because of the leak? Annoying, because not all things R-a-p-i-d-s-h-a-r-e hosts is a leak you know.)
- Mega upload server
- Give some trusted people the file and let them start seeding a torrent, the more people who download, the more people who can seed. I would be willing to seed the game with 50 kb/ps + (and the more people who do this, the higher the download speed)

We shouldn't argue about how we are going to distribute ESF, we should just use all available popular ways to upload it and distribute it. If we use the servers above, everyone should be able to download with there own preferred server. We shouldn't really say that ESF world shouldn't get the file because of the rappy wait times, we should just give it to them, maybe someone will use it. The more different servers, the better.

 

[Yugi_Yami]

Im all in for bt.. I mean really if everyone just seeds when they go to bed then theres no probs ^_^ And i could most likely help out with hosting it aswell. Even tho its gonna rape my host

 

[Kreshi]

ask valve to support your mod.
an auto-update via steam would be awesome.

 

[markg85]

hmm.. it sure looks like alot of people are only thinking in there own advantage!!

let me repeat what i said earlier... programmers don`t want to put in alot of time to get packages out and running (i have experience with that so i know what i`m talking about) programmers just want to do a few simple things or perhaps just one thing to get it ready for you..

Here is what a programmer needs to do to get a new svn build online:

... compile the esf source
svn commit "the message.. example: beta 1.3 fixed models or anything like it"

and here is what users need to do to download a version:

svn co svn.esforces.com/trunk latest-esf-beta

or this to checkout a certain revision:

svn co -r 10 svn.esforces.com/trunk esf-beta-revision-10

so as you can see this is quite simple. they could even write a crontab that does the committing automatically every week.

for torrents, usenet, ftp or any other method that i know of they will need to do ALOT MORE things to get it up. http example:

1. ..compile the package
2. rar/zip/tar the package
3. upload the package
4. verify if it`s working
5. add the stuff to the esforces main page

step 5 will need to be done always but 2, 3 and 4 won`t.. guess you get the point
for torrents it`s about the same

now for a reaction on the "HELP HOW TO DO THIS AND THAT..."
the distribution method should be something that doesn`t take much of the teams team (my opinion) and if you as a user want to have it you will just have to do something for it. so usenet could be ok aswell. bad luck if people don`t know how to use it.. there are alot of sites that explain how it works. hell there are even sites dedicated to explain usenet methods..

 

[Kenny83]

Out of curiosity, would you be able to host in on FilePlanet at all? I know it wouldn't benefit everyone here because of the subscription requirement, but for those that do... good choice.

 

[dan_esf_fanatic]

Oh for god's sake, it's perfectly simple. There are FREE servers where you can host it. MegaUpload, SendSpace, SaveFile, FileFront, HL2Files etc. BitTorrent can be used but I don't think it's worth it. I really don't get the point of this thread anymore, everyone is saying what they think is best, over and over and over. I think I'm right when I say this thread should be closed, because there's absolutely no point to repeat our opinion yet another time. The team is smart, they'll find a way to host it so everyone can dl it, be it via Torrent or otherwise. And we've helped them a lot in this thread, but now it's over. Problem solved. Why keep posting?

 

[markg85]

Oh for god's sake, it's perfectly simple. There are FREE servers where you can host it. MegaUpload, SendSpace, SaveFile, FileFront, HL2Files etc. BitTorrent can be used but I don't think it's worth it. I really don't get the point of this thread anymore, everyone is saying what they think is best, over and over and over. I think I'm right when I say this thread should be closed, because there's absolutely no point to repeat our opinion yet another time. The team is smart, they'll find a way to host it so everyone can dl it, be it via Torrent or otherwise. And we've helped them a lot in this thread, but now it's over. Problem solved. Why keep posting?

i don`t want to be rude but nearly everyone is posting OFFTOPIC this topic is about my proposal or improvements in it... not about those free upload sites.

so now a request to all: post ontopic or don`t post!!

so ontopic now!! do you like the proposal? if not tell why so that the team can do something with it. if you don`t have a based argument don`t bother posting it.

 

[Pemalite]

HAHAHAHAHA-aha-aha-ha... Ohh, that was good.

Torrents are quite possibly the most primitive way to obtain data that exists today. P2P usually fails, as it's difficult to receive data at a fast enough rate, than if you were pulling it directly off a server (aka "direct download", aka "HTTP download"). I remember 1 year ago when I used torrents, and I could never get a download rate above 150kb/s. Pathetic. I'm on a 10MBit connection, so I should not have that problem. But sadly, that's the case with almost any P2P program. When downloading via an HTTP link, I can get anywhere up to 2MB/s, and that goes even higher on Usenet.

Then you have the "seeding" factor. Most BT clients hog significant memory, so who in their right mind would want to seed 24/7, when they could be doing something else instead?

Think about all of that for a second. No, seriously, let it sink in.

uTorrent uses less than 2Mb of system memory making that point moot.
And When I am on Holidays over in Brisbane Australia, I stay at a relatives house, And use they're ADSL 2+ Connection (24Mbps) And can usually download at about 8-12Mbps on a torrent. (I use Private torrent trackers).
And seeding isn't that hard, Allot of company's are starting to move to Torrents as a way to get they're software out into the public, Plus Seeding isn't that hard, Give what you get, then move on, Maintaining the bandwidth insnt that hard, and it is hell of allot cheaper than buying the bandwidth through a server of some kind.

I have a 1.5Mb Connection at home and can download at 160Kbps on a majority of torrents.

You obviously are too noobish to choose the correct torrent file, or You have your system configured incorrectly.

" Files: 9.18 mil ? Size: 304.55 TB ? Peers: 26.22 mil " - Thats off the front page of Iso hunt, If it is that primitive and slow, why are there this many people using it? and this many files? Think about it.... Seriously... Let it sink in.... ^.^

You only need 1 or 2 people seeding the complete file,And people would still get great speeds. I for one will seed, as I only play the game offline.
People have to upload while they download y'know


I like the proposal Gohan, But I think more than one method of downloading it is required.

 

[dan_esf_fanatic]

Why buy ANYTHING when you can have it for free and fast? Just upload it on hosting sites, there's no shame in that. Most of them hold files for more than 14 days, which is exactly how much time the team needs to keep the files up, until the next update. As for the first release, they can host it on HL2Files, and EVERYONE can download it.

@Gohanssj2!!: Dude, I realize you're frustrated because no one is listening to you, but understand most of us don't know what you're talking about, at least I don't. You started talking about SVN's and stuff, and I don't even know what they are. But your topic was ESF Open Beta Distribution method. So it was about a method of getting out the release to the public, which is exactly what we're discussing. If you want us to post on topic, please say your suggestion in a way that we'll all understand. Alright?

 

[Cheeseman]

Whilst the team appreciates ALL of the users input on this matter, It would seem we have recieved enough feedback from this thread to form a reasonable idea about the method in which the team will endeavour to undertake in the process of distribution for the much anticipated open beta.

Once again, thank you one and all for your input, Every post has been read with due attention, and every voice has been heard, It's time to leave it up to the people that make the decisions in the best interests of community, and have some faith.

This thread has passed its meaningful use by date, If yo have a revelation regarding this topic, I suggest you PM the appropriate person.

Thank You