ESF is broken

[Cho]

In response to evirustheslaye: your wrong guy. "Pro's" distinguish eachother by the way they play. Every "pro" plays different. I dont know about the euro side, but I can tell when I'm fighting Gohan or Saru or Dark or Jinx. The thing is, if you dont know how to play, we are not goin show off. Were just goin side hit you to death. It's kinda like the dbz series...what's the point of powering up to SSJ just to fight some low level goons[god that sounded nerdy]. And as far as I can tell, not one American player scripts. I think the reason they play are they are just killing time waiting for someone good to join.

In response to Dave:

Randomness will kill it for a lot of the older players. I do X amount of hits, player dies. I turn this way, I hit my opponent. I turn that way I hit him this way. Esf is a very precise game. If you take away the preciseness and turn it into some FPS spray and pray game..I know I wont be around for it.

Anyways, that's my two bits. Though I do think the esf team needs to release a patch that gets rid of ground hits. I dont think they understand how much they can ruin the game.

 

[Grega]

With randomness he didnt mean the random arrow style we have now. He ment it will be harder to read the persons moves. The distances of movement will be closer. Basicly you could say youll have less time to react.

 

[harSens]

Let's face it, the learning curve is huge. You might say to yourself that this is ok, but when 99 percent of the people playing quit because it's too hard to learn, there's a problem. There is no safe place where people can go to learn to play the game. They can't learn ingame, they'd get killed before they even got a hit off. There's no place outside of the game, the only outside reference people have is the ESF manual, which doesn't help much. We can't even say the "secret melee combos" on the forum.

Well, ultimatly we'd like ESF to be easy to learn, yet hard to master. Training can be done against easy bots or the community could set up 'learning' servers. If we find the time, we might add a crash course like tutorial game. Besides that, 1.3 adds a lot of fun stuff for those that just want to mess around, like throwing env models, a new ps system, buu's bodypart, etc.

The next big reason is melee. Melee is a load of fun, don't get me wrong, but it's incredibly unbalanced. It's also the main cause of the huge learning curve the game has, simply because it's so effective. I'm talking about Simple Melee of course. Advanced Melee is neither fun nor useful. There's a pretty steep learning curve for Advanced melee and not any return to the player for learning such a system. This is because the outcome of Advanced Melee fights usually relies on random hits.

It kind of creates a Paradox. Yeah, you can have a lot of fun with Simple Melee and it's a great system, but no one learns it because of how effective it is. If you look at ESF's playerbase in America, the majority of the people playing are the ones that got the game when 1.2 first came out. Why is this? Is it because that was the only time when people could play the game without being dominated? I think so.

The new melee system should fix some of these issues, however we'd like to keep awarding melee movement skills. More varied class traits might give users that prefer beams over melee their own characters (and vice-versa).

Then there's SSJ. This is the one area in the game that I believe will actually be fixed in 1.3. The current problem is that upon transforming, you gain two times the speed, Ki, PL, and more attacks. It's completely ridiculous. You can travel twice the speed at half the Ki cost. It removes one key aspect from the game, Ki managment. From my understanding, in 1.3, there's a constant ki drainage once you transform. This is a perfect way to fix the problem.

Powerlevel and possibly ki multipliers are gone in 1.3.

Truth be told, the issue of PL all together is unfair. You're rewarding the good players by making the game easier for them. If there is one pro on a server (which is usually the case), he can get enough of a PL advantage that anyone dies in one sequence of hits (for example, three simple melee hits + Yellow beam = death). The entire server is essentially at the discretion of the one pro in the server. If he wants to beamspam, everyone in the server will die, a lot. It's unacceptable to have one player consistently get a score of 100 - 5 and everyone else scores like 2 and 20.

The max beam radius is reduced to prevent beamspam. Other than that, we plan to keep on rewarding skill with pl gain.

 

[wheres_]

Powerlevel and possibly ki multipliers are gone in 1.3.

Wow, that's pretty massive- might as well rename the mod while your at it

 

[john_volkov]

actually I find it ok, I just think the victim should have more of a chance to launch a counterstrike.

I'v forgat to finish it after he finish the simple melee only one ki blast and killed, and i did even recover

 

[sub]

Powerlevel and possibly ki multipliers are gone in 1.3.


The max beam radius is reduced to prevent beamspam. Other than that, we plan to keep on rewarding skill with pl gain.

Thank God.

 

[Rayne]

Powerlevel and possibly ki multipliers are gone in 1.3.

This means transformations will only give you speed/attacks at the cost of ki drain? If so I think its a good idea.

 

[Koren]

i agree that the 1.2.3 melee system is lame but as for teleporting i dont care if someone does it all the time it just makes it more of a challenge and thats why i play this game and the fact that they are making it so u have less time to react is great makes it more like the show. Show is fast paced so should this game. The thing i dont like about the ssj system is the KI. In the show Super Saiyans had an enormous amount of ki but when you swooped you drained half your bar its really annoying.

 

[-=[EEF]=-Ghost]

I agree with the huge learning curve. I do get annoyed sometimes when noobs complain about not knowing how to play. If it's true that your ki slowly drains when in ssj mode, I hope that they make it so when you reach the 'perfect' pl, it will no longer drain your pl. I dunno if that would still make it unbalnced so tell me if it would.

As for some of you guys disliking 'pros', if any of you had met me in a server, you would change your generalization on them. I actually take it upon myself to change my tactics. I find that a fun game is better than killing everyone off...

 

[evirustheslaye]

when saying "pros" i use the quotation marks to signify they arnt real pros but people who are so full of them self that they like to think their pros, when all their doing is sticking to the "best" method even if it means being extremly mundane in the process.

would it kill some of these people to give the opponent an inch just to humor them?

 

[hiddenmist]

personally im no pro but i think i have a good amount of skill. i play according to my opponents skill. if does not know how to play i let him hit me around and stuff but i still kill him but i give him a chance to hit me and follow me and try to learn on his own. now if the player is a pro i go all out. sometimes im fighting a pro and a noobie comes in the way and i kill him by accident hehe but then i say im sry

u guys know wat im trying to say.

BTW

the biggest thing that annoyes me the most is the fact that ssj is to powerful and the trunks and gohan can go ssj at 1 mill.

 

[EncorE_SX]

Changes r good.

I might aswell start playing this game again after 1.3 is out.

Why I and crapload other people quitted ?
Linearity and once you learn all its kind off boring.

Go changes

 

[john_volkov]

the biggest thing that annoyes me the most is the fact that ssj is to powerful and the trunks and gohan can go ssj at 1 mill.

No it's not Trunks or Gohan ar not that strog more Ki for you in fight's
and when you asscend after 3-4 frags you will kick his ass

 

[~*Logan*~]

The only thing that's broken is the community. People forget that this is a video game, yet people complain, insult, and die to be right and the best as if it's going to affect the rest of their lives.

Gameplay problems can be fixed. The people who play this cannot. ESF is not about having fun anymore. It's about who can kick who's ass and how much you can brag about it. And once it starts, it will never stop. Ever.

Because someone is "pro," he finds it right to completely put down people worse than him, or play differently than him. In short, it's a sort of superiority complex. Bow down or be killed, pretty much.

This is a small community, and 1/2 of the community acts this way. If 1.3 is going to change as much as Harsens has said, then perhaps the bull****ting will end. Or perhaps, it will just get worse.

 

[~Dark Trunks~]

The reason i think esf is broken is because in order to become a decent player you have to fight with the same tactics as everyone else. 2x basic melee hits + 1 ground hit +gen beam. Its the same combo over and over and over with every player that plays this game. There is no variety in moves that can be pulled off its pretty much the same basic hits. Yeah sure some people are better at using this then other with their different teleports, anticipation of other players moves and other things, but in the end its all the same. No matter what server i go in or where i play it always seems like im fighting the same person i just fought in a different room and to be honest its boring.

Also the community has its share of good respectable players and bad win at any cost sore loser type players but in all honesty what gaming community doesnt have the same type of thing goin on.

But as for esf i think 1.3 needs to have a change so massive that former 1.2 pros should not be able to waltz in any room and be able to rule it with such ease. I dont think the game should be changed all around but i do think pros as well as new players should have some learning to do in general.

 

[~*Logan*~]

The reason i think esf is broken is because in order to become a decent player you have to fight with the same tactics as everyone else. 2x basic melee hits + 1 ground hit +gen beam. Its the same combo over and over and over with every player that plays this game. There is no variety in moves that can be pulled off its pretty much the same basic hits. Yeah sure some people are better at using this then other with their different teleports, anticipation of other players moves and other things, but in the end its all the same. No matter what server i go in or where i play it always seems like im fighting the same person i just fought in a different room and to be honest its boring.

Also the community has its share of good respectable players and bad win at any cost sore loser type players but in all honesty what gaming community doesnt have the same type of thing goin on.

But as for esf i think 1.3 needs to have a change so massive that former 1.2 pros should not be able to waltz in any room and be able to rule it with such ease. I dont think the game should be changed all around but i do think pros as well as new players should have some learning to do in general.

I disagree. You can mix it up with things all you want. The only problem is that everyone else will think it's cheap or spamming or what not.

For example. Instead of a gen beam, if you're fast enough, you can whip up a Gallick Gun, SBC, Finger Laser, or Masenko/Powerbeam after hitting someone to the floor. it won't be fully charged, however, but for a minimal charged one, it can be done.

However, if you kill your opponent with said attack, it's usually considered spam, especially if you kill a pro with it.

So sure. Mix it up all you want. After all, this is a game based off DBZ, so play like a DBZ character if you want. Just be careful of all the negative feedback. But hey, you can just ignore that mess.

 

[sub]

I'm hoping you're not referring to people getting mad when you "Throwing + Fingerlazer" someone. That's as cheap as it gets. That attack is one of the reasons I think the game is broken in the first place, you can do atleast 80 damage with it.

Other than attacks like that, I agree with the post.

 

[~*Logan*~]

I'm hoping you're not referring to people getting mad when you "Throwing + Fingerlazer" someone. That's as cheap as it gets. That attack is one of the reasons I think the game is broken in the first place, you can do atleast 80 damage with it.

Other than attacks like that, I agree with the post.

Not hardly. THAT is something worth getting pissed over. I get mad when it's done to me too. It's a powerful combo to use, but a pain in the ass to be up against.

I'm talking about people who immediately label a single "beamkill" as spamming.

"YOU KILLED ME WITH A KAMEHAMEHA! YOU'RE A NO GOOD SPAMMER!!!"

You'd be surprised how many "pros" act that way.

 

[Chakra-X]

Well even in the 'main' match rules have rules against using any ki attack besides ki blasts and generic beams, which really discourages all the other attacks.

I'd like the attacks (or atleast a decent amount of them. I don't expect this to apply to something like Final Flash) to be easier or more appropiate to use in a intesified fight. I get a disturbed feeling when I see others, or even myself, just throwin' a couple of ki blasts/a generic beam at a person when they are knocked down/back. I try to put a little kamehameha/masenko/spirit bomb if I see a good enough opening, just to make a DBZ mod feel more like DBZ.

 

[evirustheslaye]

The reason i think esf is broken is because in order to become a decent player you have to fight with the same tactics as everyone else. 2x basic melee hits + 1 ground hit +gen beam. Its the same combo over and over and over with every player that plays this game. There is no variety in moves that can be pulled off its pretty much the same basic hits. Yeah sure some people are better at using this then other with their different teleports, anticipation of other players moves and other things, but in the end its all the same. No matter what server i go in or where i play it always seems like im fighting the same person i just fought in a different room and to be honest its boring.

Also the community has its share of good respectable players and bad win at any cost sore loser type players but in all honesty what gaming community doesnt have the same type of thing goin on.

But as for esf i think 1.3 needs to have a change so massive that former 1.2 pros should not be able to waltz in any room and be able to rule it with such ease. I dont think the game should be changed all around but i do think pros as well as new players should have some learning to do in general.

exactly, when i used to run temperary servers i would kick people for being too repetitive