Mosque at Ground Zero

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I find it amusing that, in the defence of free speech, J-Dude actively censors the people debating with him if they say something he does not like. In a way, you are attacking what you yourself are - a person who censors others when you feel insulted or annoyed.

Do you lack the self-insight to realize that what you are doing is exactly what you hate? Or is it fine, as long as you only swear at people?
 
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**** ** **** **** * ** ***** *** * **.

There, I said it.
 
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PAIN ur the one who is ignorant i saw ur post , with that disgusting picture . you have no respect for anyone . so its best that i ignore you


Sup najeeb, didn't see you there. Your prophet was a pedo btw. ~Pain
 
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I find it amusing that, in the defence of free speech, J-Dude actively censors the people debating with him if they say something he does not like. In a way, you are attacking what you yourself are - a person who censors others when you feel insulted or annoyed.

Do you lack the self-insight to realize that what you are doing is exactly what you hate? Or is it fine, as long as you only swear at people?
J-dude had always been a walking irony. He calls others blind while he fervently spouts his ignorant rhetoric about climate change, or evolution, or as it seems now, free speech.

The reason people are poking at you is not because of your religion. Your religion is only a symptom of your ignorance. It's ironic that your signature says "the ascension is complete" and yet you are stuck, bogged down by your own mental blocks. You still claim to be a christian. Why? With all the problems you claim to be aware of with your own holy book, why would you still think it is the divine word of god? You claim to have such great attachment to reason and logic, and yet you still believe in the supernatural. You even claim to be a fan of Thunderf00t's. Has he taught you nothing?

Atheist is not a dirty word.

What you need to do is tell your "gay friend" to come out. Tell "him" to stop living a lie, and maybe "he" won't have so much stress and be so quick to anger.

Yea, I said it. It was obvious.
 
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J-dude had always been a walking irony. He calls others blind while he fervently spouts his ignorant rhetoric about climate change, or evolution, or as it seems now, free speech.

The reason people are poking at you is not because of your religion. Your religion is only a symptom of your ignorance. It's ironic that your signature says "the ascension is complete" and yet you are stuck, bogged down by your own mental blocks. You still claim to be a christian. Why? With all the problems you claim to be aware of with your own holy book, why would you still think it is the divine word of god? You claim to have such great attachment to reason and logic, and yet you still believe in the supernatural. You even claim to be a fan of Thunderf00t's. Has he taught you nothing?

Atheist is not a dirty word.

What you need to do is tell your "gay friend" to come out. Tell "him" to stop living a lie, and maybe "he" won't have so much stress and be so quick to anger.

Yea, I said it. It was obvious.
I saw this went down like a snowball, I might have missed something along the lines, but I seriously didn't find J-dude contradicting his own beliefs. Although, I trust you guys, and I sure I missed something, if you could just present some of his contradicting quotes to enlighten me.

1 more thing I want to say is, that the fact he believs in the supernatural, doesn't make him irrational. Thing is, if you only believe in what you see, you can also say it is a way of narrowing your mind and perspective of things. Everything you neglect get your view's range narrowed down. It is like we believe in other dimensions, maybe in those dimensions there is light gravity and people have a third eye. You can not narrow your mind in anyway, not if it is secular views nor religious ones
 
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Here's the thing; I've barely as much as MENTIONED my being Christian, and when I did, I did so either to criticize members of my own religion that can't accept division of Church and State, or take a stab at how my own religion's earlier scriptures have equally Barbaric messages, which I content to have long done away with for the sake of reason...and I'm still getting personal sniping regarding my religion?? What more do you people want of me, my ****ing soul?? I'm a Christian, DEAL WITH IT! I'm also an opponent to anti-gay legislation and have serious verbal throw-downs with people who use the word "******" in a homophobic context.

I'm not sure why you're mentioning that you're Christian as you don't matter. Any comparison I've made between extremist Christianity and extremist Islam is to show that all of the problems that exist in the countries you want to exploit and destroy also exist in America. Unfortunately, a large portion of America is both Christian and completely retarded, so they say and do things that are dangerous to our country and, again, are comparable to the things the crazies do overseas. No, the Christians here don't typically behead others. Instead, they lynch and build pipebombs. A little different, yeah, but I'm still not a fan.

What? You're anti-anti homosexuality! You're so progressive! It's almost like you live and let live! Almost, but not quite because everything you've said up to this point contradicts that. Your "friend" is gay. Cool. Whatever. I'm sure if it hadn't hit as close to home as it did, possibly in a very nearby closest, you'd still be completely against it.


Also, no, I'm not a bigot for seeing all that goes on over there and having less and less faith in the notion that this live-fire version of "Lord of the Flies" is going to right itself of it's own accord. I don't know what became of Iran, but I doubt even if their election went the way they wanted that they're any keener on changing their government so it revolves around the needs of all people instead of the needs of Allah. Show me proof of that, I'll observe in interest. But thus far all I've seen is a time-warp centered around the 15th century, repeated over and over like a broken record. And for the record, anytime I see an obvious Muslim on the streets, I might take notice, since they're rarer to come across, but I never assume anything about Muslims who live in the United States.

No, you're a bigot for thinking most muslims are extremists, and believing its our right to subjugate them and their homelands based on a completely irrational notion that America is somehow superior, be it because of "our" morals, values, our military strength which you point out later, or because, I don't know, you have a cooler religion because it doesn't chop off heads anymore. Btw, according to your religion, Muslims are infidels. That's actually where the term originated from. Just an fyi.

If you don't know about Iran, how about you ****ing educate yourself? Just the one time. I shouldn't have to spoon feed you information every time your ignorance on a subject is made painfully clear. Show me proof that Iran is completely ass backwards and their people want a caliphate.


As to the America bashing, I'm weary of hearing it. It's totally overblown in proportion to how much the world media points its cameras at us, like a microscope. We have no more troubles as a people and as a country than any of our allies or critics; we're just fashionable to rag on and blame for the world's ills as people sidestep their own problems. And of course, because you can ***** at America and mostly get no reaction back. Despite having the most powerful military in the history of creation, we don't send so much as a rock in the general direction of our detractors, which is more than I can say for a lot of countries spread across the planet.

Yeah, because I'm only able to see the inconsistencies and issue with our country because those evil international news stations are feeding me bogus information. Only in your world is an individual incapable of using critical thinking and analysis to view his country of origin from an objective viewpoint. And that's the world I hope to someday destroy. Do you know why people focus so much on America? Because we're capable of doing so much good, and yet we use our wealth and power for, dare I say, evil. Because we're constantly sticking our nose in everyone's business, because we're imperialistic, because our tentacles reach across the globe. That's why. Not because it's the cool thing to do. That's goddamn retarded.

We don't sic our military on our detractors? What about the time our military was used in the middle east, south america, southeast asia, africa.....blah blah blah. You're blind. Any place that didn't want to play ball with us economically gets ****ed. That's how we roll. For the love of John The Baptist, read our history.


In short, you douchebags who have more of a problem with ME and my RELIGION and the fact that I HAVE a religion than what I actually have to contribute, stop beating around the bush and just be up-front for once. Just tell me you hate my guts for being religious or for being tired of the international status quo and far more interested in seeing some real problems solved than sitting around pretending that some people can actually be reached by the snail-like dance of diplomacy. At the very least it'll make it easier to add certain people to my ignore list for being high-and-mighty, pretend-to-know-betters who try to suggest they're in their 30's or something (yeah sure, there are really working adults with jobs that matter visiting a forum for a Dragonball Z Half Life mod; happens all the time in between bouts of Farmville) or else like they're Harvard graduates in the realms of physics, anthropology and sociology.

While I hate your religion, my problem isn't with Jesus freaks. It's with you and everyone like you who claims to think logically and rationally, who claims to uphold the values of our constitution, who claims to be willing to fight and die for our freedoms. Why? Because to you they're just words. You don't believe any of it, and the more you post, the more evident that fact becomes. Quite frankly, it's disgusting.
Once again, you say you want to take action. Diplomacy is too slow! Rabblerabblerabble! Well, ****ing do something. Enlist, buy some guns and a plane ticket, I don't know. But do something. I'm tired of hearing brainwashed kiddies banging the war drums, far far away from where the battles actually take place. You want some? Go and get it. I've had my share, and I'm in no hurry to get anymore.

Obviously, you won't. Because you're weak and you're a coward. Because you don't believe in the things you say. Because your life is too important to you to waste on an esoteric ideal.

@Deco: He's irrational because he ignores what is plainly obvious, attributes his and my country's flaws to the world while putting us on a pedestal and, despite having little first-hand knowledge on anything, states things as if they were factual. He refuses to learn our history, and instead prefers to rewrite it so that we aren't to blame for anything. At several points, he has claimed to stand for freedom of speech, but has told me to stop speaking several times. That is contradictory. He claims not to have anything against muslims, but claims the majority of muslims are extremist. He hates extremists. If the majority of muslims are extremist, and he hates extremists, it stands to reason he hates the majority of muslims. Of course, this entire notion is silly because the majority of muslims are, in fact, moderate.
 
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Thank you for pointing out who you are so I can ignore you, although there are so many pricks on this board that I don't find ANYWHERE else, that I'm really not sure I want anything to do with it anymore. I love ESF, love the updates, but the people here are more judgmental and pseudo-intellectual than anything I've ever seen anywhere. I'm curious as to how this happens, why the biggest cavalcade of ultra-ultra left wingers is on a damn Dragonball mod forum. What kind of screwed up anomaly is this? I frequent the forums for Garry's Mod, and there's no such league-of-extraordinary-libertarians or whatever there.

Either way, I'm ignoring the couple jerks here who are politest when they're passive aggressive, and at all other times *******s, because I'm tired of having to deal with you. You put words in my mouth, you demonize me, you demonize my country, you demonize my religion. But get this: you're quite within your right to say those things, however I'm also quite within MY right not to listen. So here's a farewell middle finger to tdogg90 and Avenger, as you two are no longer my problem.

Also, big thank you to The Deco, for his kind words.

So sorry I didn't make your list. I'll try harder next time. ~Pain
 
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1 more thing I want to say is, that the fact he believs in the supernatural, doesn't make him irrational. Thing is, if you only believe in what you see, you can also say it is a way of narrowing your mind and perspective of things. Everything you neglect get your view's range narrowed down. It is like we believe in other dimensions, maybe in those dimensions there is light gravity and people have a third eye. You can not narrow your mind in anyway, not if it is secular views nor religious ones
Watch out! There's a dragon behind you. Did you look? Of course not, there's no logical reason to think there would be. Just because someone told you so is not a legitimate reason to believe in something, blindly, I might add, because there is ZERO proof. Thus, illogical.

It's funny when people try to tell me I'm close minded, or narrow minded, or whatever else. Just because I'm skeptical doesn't mean I'm a zealot. There's a difference between being open minded and letting your brain fall out.
 
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Thank you for pointing out who you are so I can ignore you, although there are so many pricks on this board that I don't find ANYWHERE else, that I'm really not sure I want anything to do with it anymore. I love ESF, love the updates, but the people here are more judgmental and pseudo-intellectual than anything I've ever seen anywhere. I'm curious as to how this happens, why the biggest cavalcade of ultra-ultra left wingers is on a damn Dragonball mod forum. What kind of screwed up anomaly is this? I frequent the forums for Garry's Mod, and there's no such league-of-extraordinary-libertarians or whatever there.

Either way, I'm ignoring the couple jerks here who are politest when they're passive aggressive, and at all other times *******s, because I'm tired of having to deal with you. You put words in my mouth, you demonize me, you demonize my country, you demonize my religion. But get this: you're quite within your right to say those things, however I'm also quite within MY right not to listen. So here's a farewell middle finger to tdogg90 and Avenger, as you two are no longer my problem.

Also, big thank you to The Deco, for his kind words.
Because as a matter of course, when someone says something you don't like, you silence them. You silence them and pretend their words do not exist, as they have the potential to cause one to rethink their world view, and possibly change their perspective. This can not be allowed, for to allow such a thing is to admit that perhaps one was wrong or everything one thought to be true was wrong.

Don't rock the boat, baby.

I just want to point out how hilarious it is to have a chickenhawk tell me, an enlisted member of of the United States Marine Corps and a grunt at that, that I'm demonizing his country. I'm sure J-Dude will "fight for my freedom" when given the opportunity. He's just biding his time.
 
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Ignoring Zeo and Avenger isn't really a mature way to settle your differences right? Believing in freedom of speech, but then ignoring someone whenever they post their opinions about your religion, views, what-have-you is somewhat contradictory. On a sidenote, you should stop falling back on your religion everytime. Most of the people around here, although Atheïst, have no immediate problems with your religion but more problems with you. And I can somewhat understand them, since you do tend to contradict yourself in 90% of your posts. Even just now you said that Zeo constantly puts his words in your mouth, while you do exactly the same. You constantly force the fact that we try to demonize your religion through our throats, while that is completely besides the point. Hell, Zeo even stated it in his last post.

You are overly defensive/sensitive whenever the word Christianity is any post, blaming everyone that they are attacking your religion. Try to stay a bit more open-minded, like many of us have told you many times before and stop taking everything so damn personal. You might be 'attacked' less often then.
 
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Ignoring Zeo and Avenger isn't really a mature way to settle your differences right? On a sidenote, you should stop falling back on your religion everytime. Most of the people around here, although Atheïst, have no immediate problems with your religion but more problems with you. And I can somewhat understand them, since you do tend to contradict yourself in 90% of your posts. Even just now you said that Zeo constantly puts his words in your mouth, while you do exactly the same. You constantly force the fact that we try to demonize your religion through our throats, while that is completely besides the point. Hell, Zeo even stated it in his last post.

You are overly defensive/sensitive whenever the word Christianity is any post, blaming everyone that they are attacking your religion. Try to stay a bit more open-minded, like many of us have told you many times before and stop taking everything so damn personal. You might be 'attacked' less often then.
Look, if I'm actually doing any of those things, I'm not conscious of it, because my intention is always along the lines of "these guys aren't getting it, time to clarify", or "this feels pretty personal, and I'm not going to be silent about it, because silence suggests compliance". I say what I think. But I'm also aware that guys like Pain and Avenger (who I'm guessing by his constant tones of smug superiority is "Zeo") openly despise and mock my religious views every time I join an argument. Please, when nothing prompts things like "Did Jesus tell you that? H'yuk h'yuk h'yuk...!" other than the fact that you're the only religious person on the entire board, there's obvious discrimination. You've HEARD them! A LOT of the reason they think I'm stupid, ignorant or whatever, is purely because I believe in something that I cannot prove to be there, or at least that's what they base everything else about me from.

And it always astounds me that nobody notes my progress. I once hated gays, now I support their cause. I was once against separation of Church and State, but now I see it as an imperative. I once considered myself a Republican and cringed the day Obama won, but now I feel more like a Democrat and am glad to see someone who seems DIFFERENT, who might help or inspire the solving of many of our problems. But no, apparently I am an uncanny-valley of political values, in that I'm close enough to being liberal, that all my non-liberal parts get noticed that much more, and the reaction is of disgust or even fear.
 
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It's not that anyone's holding anything against you J-dude, its just the fact you're completely bigotted and mis-informed when it comes to the Islamic faith.That's what people are in abhorrant shock over, It doesnt help that you lash out at whomever objects to your ill-informed view either. What really takes the biscuit is you're entire defense is steeped in irony, since you feel discriminated against for being christian and are quick to remind us of how we all jump to the conclusion that you're just some right wing, gun slingin' racist. It's pretty hillarious.

The difference is we've all seen your views and opinions on many occasions, but it doesn't seem like you've ever met, socialised or exchanged views with anyone from the islamic faith. There are several mosques in my city, and I've met many muslims, quite a few of the kids at my school were muslim. They're all thouroughly decent people, they dont drink, they place importance on family, health, education and career. They are no different to you or I.

Since you're so keen to show us that you're open to changing your opinion, I strongly suggest that you watch "30 days as a muslim". An american conservative christian 30-year old man go lives with a muslim family for 30 days, and it's a documentary about his experiences with the family. Youtube took down part 1 3 and 4 unfortunately, but I saw it on TV, it's an excellent documentary http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUyz2vaSvVI
 
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Okay, okay, you've entirely got the wrong impression of me in this case.

I know they can be regular Joes, I come across plenty wearing the garb who talk like any of us and seem legitimately happy and interact civilly with others. I can't say there are any Mosques or that I run into them nearly as often as white guys, black guys are hispanic guys, but you don't seem to understand. It's not their religion or culture that makes me antzy, it's that region of the world, and the people living in it. I feel like if I suddenly teleported there, or in Africa, in what I'm wearing now and just walked down the street, I'd at the absolute least get dirty looks, but I don't feel like I'd last a day like that without getting knocked out and thrown into someone's van and ending up on the nightly news with a black bag over my head.

But that's not exclusive to them, I feel the same way about the states North of Florida, South of Virginia and East of Texas, like walking down the street and so much as hinting that I'm friends with black men or gay men will get me strung up from the tallest tower by some barefoot guy with missing teeth and overalls.

And as I've mentioned, I have no problem with Islamic culture. I'm absolutely fine with the women hiding their bodies, given that whole "flower blooming on her wedding day" mentality of it. If she's cool with that, sure, though I don't envy the Summer months. It's just if it's NOT up to her that I take serious issue with the mistreatment of women in relation to the Muslim ideology.
 
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I feel like if I suddenly teleported there, or in Africa, in what I'm wearing now and just walked down the street, I'd at the absolute least get dirty looks, but I don't feel like I'd last a day like that without getting knocked out and thrown into someone's van and ending up on the nightly news with a black bag over my head.
Random American walking in enemy territory. Could be used as a means to free comrades from enemy prisons, or for monetary gain. It isn't always personal. Sometimes it's just business.

In the situations where it isn't business and it is personal for them, as is the case for anyone who's lost a relative to either a cause or as collateral damage, ask yourself why they hate us in the first place. Then, rather than say what you think, do the research.

Then explain why it's America's right to correct everything it perceives to be wrong in the world.
 
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I like how whenever J-Dude posts in a thread like this, it always turns into a religious debate.

Sigh.
 
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This is why i think this thread Should be deleted
 
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This is why i think this thread Should be deleted
i Disagree i do not think that This thread should be Deleted Because the situation Can Handle Itself
 
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