Virginia Tech shooting

[Hitokiri]

I am not a gun enthusiast or an NRA supporter in any way, but plenty of people would use this situation as an argument FOR firearms. The shooting that this one just trumped, if you read up on it, was apparently a big example for gun supporters of why more people ought to carry... and subsequently it loosened gun laws in the state it happened. Arguably if there were more people around with guns that guy might not have gotten away with it. However, this happened in a school, so really... maybe they should start licensing guns to teachers >_>

But anyway... I don't see how anyone can assign motive to this guy yet ( but of course good old JT will). Apparently they can't identify him; he had no ID, no cell, no match for his fingerprints, and his face was mutilated beyond recognition when they found him.

 

[Sicron]

We Europeans have had our fair share of revolutions. We Dutch fought the Spanish for example. Half of Europe fought against Germany. But it's not like we are all carrying guns around here. Weapons have been part of your country for decades, true. But that was when you actually needed those weapons to fight an oppression of some sort. Right now, those don't happen any more. And now don't tell me you need the weapons for safety. Because if all those weapons are gone, you would be pretty much safe. (Sure there will be axe-wielding maniacs. But right now you have both gun AND axe-wielding maniacs.) If the entire American population gets pissed of if weapons are banned, I revoke my former opinion saying the leaders of America are ignorant. ALL Americans are ignorant then. (Not all, only those that support guns, so just to be sure...I'm not flaming anyone of you.)

If your best excuse to own a weapon is to say "it's part of our culture" Then I think all hope is lost. Putting dangerous culture in front of safety is seriously just stupid. There is absolutely no good reason for you to keep those guns, certainly not your culture. It is not like "OMGZ GUNZ ARE BANNED! BRITAINS INVADE OUR COUNTRY TO TAKE IT BACK?!?!?!11"

For once, learn from your past mistakes and throw those weapons away. It will save you a lot of trouble. And it will save the entire world from a lot...and I mean a lot of deaths.

Arguably if there were more people around with guns that guy might not have gotten away with it. However, this happened in a school, so really... maybe they should start licensing guns to teachers >_>

See, you said just now that you are not for guns. And now you are implying that teachers should get guns. Would this save people? Perhaps, but the fact that people will still die because that teacher will probably shoot someone. Here in Holland, we don't need to give our teachers guns. Simply because we don't have a gun culture like you do. You need guns just as much as you need air, to live. And that is ridiculous. You solve a shooting by shooting more people. Other people will get pissed by that and also start shooting people vicious circle. Ever since you got guns, you just had to use them since it was the easiest and most simplistic way to solve any problems. Just kill someone, and all is well.

 

[Vegeta]

I don't really get what makes you guys defend video games just because Jack Thompson flies in. It's kind of the principal; Thompson strikes again because he's trying to prevent violence. This is not about what he's targeting... it's just the fact he's standing up for what's right; and when there's a trace of common sense here I don't see what the point in fighting it is. Now, 33 people are died - and you actually care what Jack Thompson's doing? I just don't get it. Some of you need to wake up, and get a life.

 

[Almighty_Gir]

to elaborate on a point phobius made:

it's sad, because you know it will happen, you just don't know when.

US gun laws suck, and always will do, as long as people "have the right to bear arms"...

 

[Tassadar]

We Europeans have had our fair share of revolutions. We Dutch fought the Spanish for example. Half of Europe fought against Germany. But it's not like we are all carrying guns around here. Weapons have been part of your country for decades, true. But that was when you actually needed those weapons to fight an oppression of some sort. Right now, those don't happen any more. And now don't tell me you need the weapons for safety. Because if all those weapons are gone, you would be pretty much safe. (Sure there will be axe-wielding maniacs. But right now you have both gun AND axe-wielding maniacs.) If the entire American population gets pissed of if weapons are banned, I revoke my former opinion saying the leaders of America are ignorant. ALL Americans are ignorant then. (Not all, only those that support guns, so just to be sure...I'm not flaming anyone of you.)

You wouldn't understand. Here guns aren't thought of as a tool solely to kill. They are used for recreation, hunting, collection, and the like. Taking away a person's tool to kill is not the same as taking away their reason for it. If someone wants to kill another person, they will do it. With, or without a gun.

If your best excuse to own a weapon is to say "it's part of our culture" Then I think all hope is lost. Putting dangerous culture in front of safety is seriously just stupid. There is absolutely no good reason for you to keep those guns, certainly not your culture. It is not like "OMGZ GUNZ ARE BANNED! BRITAINS INVADE OUR COUNTRY TO TAKE IT BACK?!?!?!11"

I never said the Brits would come back if we revoke our 2nd ammendment. I'm saying we would not be the country we are now if not for our firm belief that people should be allowed to own a weapon as much as the government that protects them.

For once, learn from your past mistakes and throw those weapons away. It will save you a lot of trouble. And it will save the entire world from a lot...and I mean a lot of deaths.

Like I said, if someone wants to kill, they will do it with or without a gun. There is more to these incidents than just guns. The teens that commit these terrible crimes are usually suicidal, manicly and majorly depressed kids. Guns did not cause them to be that way. The problem is much, much deeper than guns. We have a mental health issue in this country, the like of which is not seen in any other country.

Here in Holland, we don't need to give our teachers guns. Simply because we don't have a gun culture like you do. You need guns just as much as you need air, to live. And that is ridiculous. You solve a shooting by shooting more people. Other people will get pissed by that and also start shooting people vicious circle. Ever since you got guns, you just had to use them since it was the easiest and most simplistic way to solve any problems. Just kill someone, and all is well.

I'll agree that guns can be terrible things, if used for evil. But the same can said for a lot of things. But we don't view guns solely as tools of murder. And despite whether or not you can comprehend this, we will continue to believe it. More people will die, but they will not die from guns. They will die because someone pulled the trigger. As the saying goes, guns don't kill people, people kill people. It may sound ignorant, but it is the truth.

 

[dan_esf_fanatic]

I don't really get what makes you guys defend video games just because Jack Thompson flies in. It's kind of the principal; Thompson strikes again because he's trying to prevent violence. This is not about what he's targeting... it's just the fact he's standing up for what's right; and when there's a trace of common sense here I don't see what the point in fighting it is. Now, 33 people are dead - and you actually care what Jack Thompson's doing? I just don't get it. Some of you need to wake up, and get a life.

Of course we care. It's just that we're damn pissed off that he's making fun of innocent people that died by the hands of some psycho. People that died TODAY. Do you really think that's OK? If it was your friend, or relative that died, you're saying you wouldn't get pissed off?

And another thing. People die all the time, all over the world, from disease, bombings, serial killers and similar. A fine example would be that incident that happened a while ago, when terrorists broke into a school in Russia and killed countless children. The ones that survived were kept hostage, and had to drink their own urine to survive. But you don't get all sad because of that, but when it's in America, and on the news, the whole world is riled up. There's just so many things wrong with that. I'm not saying that the deaths of 33 people is something to take for granted, but it's just that there are far greater disasters that no one pays any thought.

And Thompson is not doing this crap to prevent violence, because it causes more violence and hate than he thinks he's preventing. He's doing it because he likes being an ass. Which gets on everyone's nerves, except yours apparently.

 

[Pieter Paul Rubens]

I view a gun as a tool solely for murder.. A gun is designed to kill. There is no other reason to get a gun than to shoot stuff. And yes, even shooting moving targets (however it is called, the stuff where they yell "PULL!" all the time) is something to recreate the feeling of killing a living thing.

Now, you can go on and say that you an kill people with anything, but that doesn't mean that we have to provoke mental airheads and give away guns as if they were flyers for some rave-party next door, because **** will happen, sooner or later. It's like putting the cat near the milk or throwing a fox into your chickenhouse.

In Belgium, people can have a gun too, if they have the approval of a doctor about their mental condition, if they have a clean record (aka no past crimes (even stealing candy = no chance to get a gun), if they get approval of family and neighbours (aka, people close by), if they take lessons at the policestation and if they pass an exam that tests your knowledge of the gun and how to use it. And I've never seen anything that resembles a shooting like this in the nearly 22 years I've walked around here.

So yea, your "if they want to kill, they will" point does make sense, but that doesn't mean that people should be able to get guns so easily. Cutting down the possiblities to murder people = cutting down the deaths and number of accidents like this.

 

[kam!]

[...]Like I said, if someone wants to kill, they will do it with or without a gun. There is more to these incidents than just guns. The teens that commit these terrible crimes are usually suicidal, manicly and majorly depressed kids. Guns did not cause them to be that way. The problem is much, much deeper than guns. We have a mental health issue in this country, the like of which is not seen in any other country.[...]

It wouldn't be that easy to kill 32 people without a gun.
But you don't need to ban guns to solve the problem.
Maybe change some laws? Like people who collect guns don't need ammo, people that use guns for recreational (sports) purposes certainly don't need something like a mac10. (just some examples)

Guns don't need to be banned, but properly regulated.

 

[Grega]

When ever i read stuff like that it makes me feel like just blowing up this planet. Send the good guys to heaven and take the others to hell along with me :s

Just what goes through the minds of such morons im wondering.

Anyhow glad to heat your brother is allright and hope that nothing like this happens again. But knowing humanity... it will

 

[Chakra-X]

Banning weapons does not eliminate weapons. You could ban every gun ever made in America, that doesn't mean they can't get a hand on it.

Illegal gun trade is more severe than the 2nd amendment.

I don't really get what makes you guys defend video games just because Jack Thompson flies in. It's kind of the principal; Thompson strikes again because he's trying to prevent violence. This is not about what he's targeting... it's just the fact he's standing up for what's right; and when there's a trace of common sense here I don't see what the point in fighting it is. Now, 33 people are died - and you actually care what Jack Thompson's doing? I just don't get it. Some of you need to wake up, and get a life.

Thompson is not fighting for something right. He is exploiting a tragic event to further his own agenda. If he was so caring on the topic of violence, he would come to Philadelphia to analyze and solve the rising crime rate. He would assist the relief of the genocide of Darfur. No, he chooses something you can do in GTA and jumps on that. When a tragedy occurs, people are usually open to any reason, so this is exploitation, not help.

And while it would be nice if we could forget Thompson, that would be like seeing a bunch of people get shot and then see some jackass kick and laugh at the bodies. I would be sad for the people, but I'd also be pissed at the kid.

 

[Sicron]

We never said banning guns would eliminate weapon and weapon trade. But it would at least make it significantly harder for any common student to get a gun nowadays in America. As soon as you reach an age of 18 (or 21, whatever) You can walk in a gun shop and buy a gun (almost as easy as that), You can then go to school and kill off all your 'friends'. If guns were banned, it would be nearly impossible for a common student to get a hold of a gun (1. will cost too much, 2. to hard to get one in the illegal sector) and they will only be able to go to school with a knife and kill one, maybe two people before the entire school attacks him.

 

[Zeonix]

We never said banning guns would eliminate weapon and weapon trade. But it would at least make it significantly harder for any common student to get a gun nowadays in America. As soon as you reach an age of 18 (or 21, whatever) You can walk in a gun shop and buy a gun (almost as easy as that), You can then go to school and kill off all your 'friends'. If guns were banned, it would be nearly impossible for a common student to get a hold of a gun (1. will cost too much, 2. to hard to get one in the illegal sector) and they will only be able to go to school with a knife and kill one, maybe two people before the entire school attacks him.

It would also be easier to enforce martial law and have troops roaming around our streets if someone ever got the idea that tyranny is the way to go.

The founding fathers believed we have the right to bear arms, and that's good enough for me.

 

[Jimdapredator]

man wenever sumthing like this happens in america its all tears and prayers but if it happens in the middle east (like for example a suicide bombing that just happened in afghanistan) its uninteresting war news

but still it IS bigger than columbine so holy crap!


EDIT: lol what your founding fathers meant was every american has the right to hang a pair of bear arms on the wall... or wear sleevless shirts

 

[zeldalink]

Wastn columbine highschool shootiing like 3 or 4 days from now ?
seriously next things are going to come up :
-they arnt gona say rnb warped his little ittie bittie bwain like they said to had happend with harris and the other guy from columbine had with metal.
-theyre gona say hes a right wing extremist and did this in honor of hitler or some crap like that.
-with columbine they blamed games see how its happening again.


these people blame each and everyone except for the fact that they should mostly be looking in the mirror cause well "normal" people are the cause of the pain of allot of people they kick everyone out of theyre little groups and piss m off some people like this dude shot up an entire class and so did the columbine kids.

why cant we just love one and other and snuggle or smth man peace not war


the first one who calls me a hippy is gone get a kick to the groin XD

my dearest respects for all the people lost or hurt, im half american and well...im sorry to say that but americans kindof put this on themselves 70% of all the kids are raising themselves and what would you expect to happen if your gona let that happen ? obiest kids(aka mcdonald kids), kids with low self esteam cause dady never wubbled them n stuff like that....

god people cmon we dont like this crap from happening so why wont we be nice to others for a change ?

 

[Epedemic_Optikz]

Apparently, the people got killed execution style. Maybe if one of those people who got killed had a gun, the death count wouldn't be above 30. Hell if all of them had a gun, he'd only have killed 1 or 2 people. Let everyone have a gun, more peaceful because everyone feels protected and doesn't have to rely on unreliable cops to come 30 minutes later and do nothing but eat a donut and take information down. With or without gun, as said before, someone will kill someone so it wouldn't matter if everyone had a gun or not.

 

[wheres_]

You people brought it on yourselves, get some ****ing gun control.

 

[Pieter Paul Rubens]

Apparently, the people got killed execution style. Maybe if one of those people who got killed had a gun, the death count wouldn't be above 30. Hell if all of them had a gun, he'd only have killed 1 or 2 people. Let everyone have a gun, more peaceful because everyone feels protected and doesn't have to rely on unreliable cops to come 30 minutes later and do nothing but eat a donut and take information down. With or without gun, as said before, someone will kill someone so it wouldn't matter if everyone had a gun or not.

I'd feel a lot safer on the streets if I knew that nobody has a gun.. I mean, how on earth can you feel safe if you know that everyone you see on the street, has a gun? How can you feel safe if you know that some kid can jump around the corner and pop one in your face.. Even if you have a gun yourself, it'll be useless since you just got popped in the face without any warning..

And yes, somebody that wants to kill, will kill, but as I said before, that doesn't mean you have to put the cat with the milk and let everyone carry around guns..



God, I really don't understand the mindflow of some/most Americans :/

 

[kam!]

It would also be easier to enforce martial law and have troops roaming around our streets if someone ever got the idea that tyranny is the way to go.

The founding fathers believed we have the right to bear arms, and that's good enough for me.

Other countries don't have laws similar to the 2nd amendment, yet I don't see that germans or french asking for guns in case someone got the idea of turning their countires into a tyranny.

 

[Zeonix]

I'd feel a lot safer on the streets if I knew that nobody has a gun.. I mean, how on earth can you feel safe if you know that everyone you see on the street, has a gun? How can you feel safe if you know that some kid can jump around the corner and pop one in your face.. Even if you have a gun yourself, it'll be useless since you just got popped in the face without any warning..

And yes, somebody that wants to kill, will kill, but as I said before, that doesn't mean you have to put the cat with the milk and let everyone carry around guns..



God, I really don't understand the mindflow of some/most Americans :/

Fine. Let's take away everyone's right to own guns. Now we're all safe. Wait...oh no! Criminals still have guns and we have no way to defend ourselves. We're easy pickings. While we're packing pocket knives, criminals are still backing Ak's and submachine guns.

Oh damn. Another "terrorist attack". Somehow, they were able to blow up the Sears tower, right around the time of elections. What's that, Mr. President? You want to cancel elections and declare martial law for our protection? Troops are going to be deployed to all major cities? Isn't that against the law? Oh. The constitution is just a piece of paper, you say. Well, not like I can stop you with my taser. Let's just protest in the streets. A nice peaceful protest. You've authorized deadly force? Well, gee golly.

Hi, Kam. Germany isn't even allowed to have a large standing military force, because of what happened the last time they had weapons. You remember, right? When they walked through France? Yeah.

 

[kam!]

My point was that there are many other countries (germany was only one example) where people are not allowed to own guns and they have none of the problems you say america will have when they try to ban guns.