ScrewAttack: Goku vs Superman

[Renyori]

Watch DB(Z) and you would have known....

I have watched the entire anime. But that doesn't matter, show me it reached there in a second in the actual canon manga.

No they don't, if you think you do, you haven't been watched DBZ at all.

- Kamehameha
- Teleport Kamehameha
- Homing Energy Wave
- Spirit Bomb
- Instant Transmission

Those are all ki based, or instant transmission attacks. Half.

Goku would there be in an instant and back....

He could not replicate the champagne feat no matter how hard he tried. No he would not have reached Jupitor and back in a second. There is no ki signature for him to lock onto. Goku even struggled to teleport to New Namek during the Buu saga saying that their ki signatures were too far away. Please stop pretending that Instant Transmission works the same as movement speed.

Doomsday is a weakling compared to Freeza. I have never seen him destroying whole countries with one move, let alone a whole planet.

And I've never seen Goku destroy a city, what's your point? Doomsday has went toe to toe with gods like Darkseid.

Put your Supes glasses off please. Yes there are very different. Only the mega ki attack like kamehameha and final flash are very similar.

Put my supes glasses off? What is that even supposed to mean? Scatter shot does not use ki? What does it use then?

Again pinpointing isn't a problem with someone standing in front of you and with an insane powerlevel.

It's still required to do so before you can actually move there. Again, if he can do it reactionary then explain why Goku doesn't just disregard movement speed altogether and just instant transmission every single time he needs to move, because atleast 90% of the time he's using his movement speed in battle, not instant transmission.

You haven't read my argument. The gravity has to be different. Radditz could already lift a truck with ease, which is easily 1500KG. Your 40 ton argument is strawman and it doesn't take a genius to figure out that couldn't be right. Come with better arguments.

It is different, but only 10x. You don't seem to understand the point though. It doesn't matter if an Ant can lift 10 milligrams or 100,000 milligrams, it's still absolutely nothing compared to a Human who can lift 100 kilograms.

*sigh* Freeza, Nappa, Radditz, Saiyan Saga Vegeta all couldn't sense Ki yet where able to dodge it. Or you don't know DBZ or you are just being dishonest.

What did they dodge? Nappa didn't dodge anything since he tanked basically every blast. Anything beam that was threatening to him had to be charged up for awhile. Raditz had his scouter on in the fight. There is no proof as to how fast the beam reached the moon (don't use anime as evidence please). Also, there's no proof that every beam is the same speed. There have been times that characters have said multiple words after the beam launched at them and they blocked/dodged.

He is. Superman is one of the most 2D(Figure of speech) fighters out there, expect for most other DC characters made.

He has more abilities than Goku. He's faar faster, and hundreds of millions times stronger.

Freeza blew up planet Vegeta in 30 seconds and he wasn't even trying. Hell there was a whole army blocking his attack. We don't know what Majin Buu has been doing all these years. What we do know is that he isn't a cold hearted efficent planet buster, nor very intelligent. He could have just blown up earth and be done with it. Yet he choose to fight the DBZ characters. So no he wasn't only blowning up planets, that would have been out of character for him.

When Buu reverted back to his original form, the first thing he did was destroy Earth, after seeing Goku and Vegeta escape, he followed to kill them. Theres still no evidence of any DB character being a solar system buster. I believe they can do it with time, but definitely not in 1 shot.

Also in the latest Superman #13 issue, he was lifting, 5.972 sextillion metric tons for 5 days straight, so yeah.. Goku isn't lasting over a couple punches by Superman at full power.

 

[FalconFury]

But Goku can gather up so much energy. He'll just call out the spirit bomb and use it. Just like he used it against Cooler when his power was completely maxed.

 

[Z Power]

Yes Nathan, all we needed in this thread was you.

Goku would Spirit Bomb and everything would be k.

 

[Grega]

C'mon...There has to be a writer who gave him more than that.Again..ONLY ONE writer!

Yes but that was the ORIGINAL superman. The first and that was the powers his CREATOR gave him.

 

[Delusional]

SNIP

I feel like you're not taking SSJ forms into account.

You say goku struggled with 40 tons in otherworld.

1. I'm pretty sure the gravity is heavier there.

2. That was base form, and he didn't really "Struggle" or get pulled down really fast.

3. He transformed and effortlessly was training with it.


He has more transformations, each increasing his power by multitudes.



You keep discrediting "galaxy busting".

Buu was hopping planets and blowing them up and reforming easily, not losing nearly any energy in the process, if he decided to NOT check the planets before blowing them up, what makes you so sure that he couldn't blow multiple planets up easily?

You seem to not be able to think outside the box of "If it didn't happen it can't happen".

Super Buu killed everyone on earth without getting tired using homing missiles.

Uh, yeah, that's powerful.

He also was shattering the fabric of reality when he got mad at Vegetto, remember?

Just because the power wasn't blatantly abused doesn't mean it wasn't there.

Learn the theory not the book kinda applies here.

I'm not saying Goku would win, but you discredit everything without any real evidence.

Now consider that SSJ4 is more powerful than Buu immeasurably.



You have to consider that Raditz can catch a bullet and is the weakest character in DBZ.

Master Roshi can catch machine gun fire.

"Faster than a speeding bullet" doesn't mean much to the DBZ universe, nearly everyone can fly and jump a tall building in a single bound, and everyone is more powerful than a locomotive.

Now "FTL" arguments can be made, but it's hard to judge speed in the DBZ universe.

How fast does someone have to move to leave an after image?

After images are in Dragonball.

How fast does someone have to move to be invisible to the naked eye? See the cell saga where everyone is following the fight except the humans, and even they have difficulty keeping up.

Now consider that SSJ2 completely outclasses everything before it.

Frieza is nothing to a SSJ2. Frieza can destroy a planet easily without expending much power.

It stands to reason that a SSJ2 can destroy multiple planets easily without expending much power.

SSJ3 and SSJ4 just multiply this ability.

 

[Viper]

Ok, here's why Superman would win: Goku can deplete his energy reserves/get tired.

 

[Delusional]

Ok, here's why Superman would win: Goku can deplete his energy reserves/get tired.

Now let's say goku Instant Transmissions to an area without a yellow sun and the fight takes place there?

Wouldn't superman lose energy too?

 

[Almighty_Gir]

no, because his friend batman would give him a portable energy source.

 

[Delusional]

no, because his friend batman would give him a portable energy source.

Outside source of help, not allowed in death battle, if that's what the topic is still about.

On that note, is the sun considered outside source of help? lol

 

[Deathshot]

no, because his friend batman would give him a portable energy source.

You mean something like a Senzu beam?


@Viper: Superman can run out of energy. We have seen him do it a few times.

 

[Prozac]

Well unless Goku reads comics, he wouldn't know the source of Supermans power.

It's a bit of a non-argument. Superman would annihilate goku. The "5.972 sextillion metric ton"-bit proves that.

I think buu would stand a fair chance though, him being pretty much immune to physical damage.

 

[Delusional]

Well unless Goku reads comics, he wouldn't know the source of Supermans power.

It's a bit of a non-argument. Superman would annihilate goku. The "5.972 sextillion metric ton"-bit proves that.

I think buu would stand a fair chance though, him being pretty much immune to physical damage.

That's equivalent to moving the planet Earth.


SSJ4 might be able to, but if not, this won't even be a fair fight.

 

[Prozac]

I could be counting my zero's wrong, but I believe that's a "septillion" one zero more then a "sextillion"
No he can't fill Atlas shoes quite yet, but he's getting there.

I find it awkward that a sneeze can destroy galaxies but he can't even physically lift a single earth size planet.
I guess trying to find logic in all of this is a bit stupid on my part.

 

[Renyori]

I feel like you're not taking SSJ forms into account.

You say goku struggled with 40 tons in otherworld.

1. I'm pretty sure the gravity is heavier there.

2. That was base form, and he didn't really "Struggle" or get pulled down really fast.

3. He transformed and effortlessly was training with it.


He has more transformations, each increasing his power by multitudes.

I will concede, but once again: "It doesn't matter if an Ant can lift 10 milligrams or 100,000 milligrams, it's still absolutely nothing compared to a Human who can lift 100 kilograms."

You keep discrediting "galaxy busting".

Buu was hopping planets and blowing them up and reforming easily, not losing nearly any energy in the process, if he decided to NOT check the planets before blowing them up, what makes you so sure that he couldn't blow multiple planets up easily?

You seem to not be able to think outside the box of "If it didn't happen it can't happen".

I don't doubt he can blow up a couple planets in one go. But busting a galaxy, or even a solar system in one shot is a completely different story. No one in DBZ has shown evidence they can do that. There's even a quote that stated it took Buu YEARS to destroy HUNDREDS of planets.

Super Buu killed everyone on earth without getting tired using homing missiles.

Uh, yeah, that's powerful.

He also was shattering the fabric of reality when he got mad at Vegetto, remember?

I don't remember him shattering reality because of Vegetto, i don't think it happened in the manga. I'm not sure how that will aid Goku vs Superman though.

Just because the power wasn't blatantly abused doesn't mean it wasn't there.

Learn the theory not the book kinda applies here.

I'm not saying Goku would win, but you discredit everything without any real evidence.

Now consider that SSJ4 is more powerful than Buu immeasurably.

I know, but just saying someone is immensely more powerful than another character doesn't mean much since Superman is immensely more powerful as well. Just keep in mind that powerlevel does not work as linear as you think. Having 100x the powerlevel doesn't necessarily mean you are can lift 100x as much, move 100x as fast, have 100x the durability, etc. As I said before if it worked like that then basically every regular human would be a country buster since Roshi is a moon buster.

You have to consider that Raditz can catch a bullet and is the weakest character in DBZ.

Master Roshi can catch machine gun fire.

"Faster than a speeding bullet" doesn't mean much to the DBZ universe, nearly everyone can fly and jump a tall building in a single bound, and everyone is more powerful than a locomotive.

Now "FTL" arguments can be made, but it's hard to judge speed in the DBZ universe.

How fast does someone have to move to leave an after image?

After images are in Dragonball.

How fast does someone have to move to be invisible to the naked eye? See the cell saga where everyone is following the fight except the humans, and even they have difficulty keeping up.

"Faster than a speeding bullet" doesn't mean much to Superman as well, since a speeding bullet is basically not moving at all to Superman.

There is no evidence that a DBZ character can move FTL. I highly doubt a DB character can lap the circumference of the Earth 7.5 times in a single second.

I've heard faster than the eye can see is about 560 mph which is what is required to leave an after image.

A bullet is faster than the naked eye can see. Which average is about 1100km/h I believe.

The DBZ kind of
Now consider that SSJ2 completely outclasses everything before it.

Frieza is nothing to a SSJ2. Frieza can destroy a planet easily without expending much power.

It stands to reason that a SSJ2 can destroy multiple planets easily without expending much power.

SSJ3 and SSJ4 just multiply this ability.

Okay well, base Goku struggled to lift 40 tons in the otherworld. Let's be generous and say because of the gravity and everything, it was multiplied by 1000x. So lets say base Goku struggles with 40,000 tons. Then let's be extremely generous this time and say with the Super Saiyan buffs, it multiplies by 10,000x . So now he lifts 400 million tons. That's still nothing compared to Superman, who actually just recently lifted 5.972 sextillion metric tons for 5 days straight.

Goku wins the cooler cooler character battle. But if they were to somehow actually fight, he isn't lasting more than a couple hits from an all out Superman.

Now let's say goku Instant Transmissions to an area without a yellow sun and the fight takes place there?

Wouldn't superman lose energy too?

Then that means he just ran away from the battle.
It's not really fair to have the battle take place where only one of the characters power works.

-----

I find it awkward that a sneeze can destroy galaxies but he can't even physically lift a single earth size planet.
I guess trying to find logic in all of this is a bit stupid on my part.

That was Superman before the crisis happened. He was a lot stronger back then. With effort he can push Earth a bit. Before the crisis he could move multiple planets at the same time.

I think buu would stand a fair chance though, him being pretty much immune to physical damage.

Superman could blitz him into the core of a sun instantly. Or freeze him, then do it.

 

[FalconFury]

I think Superman CAN beat Goku you know. When superman was inside of the valcano he didn't died. But when Goku touched the valcano he felt the burn. SO yeah Goku is beat.

 

[Ness]

Goku would win, of course. Faster, stronger, and knows Kung-Fu.

 

[Shaladanra]

http://api.ning.com/files/VxzL*FZ2YvLgc4Ph56mXod4E3-OOkVzXgIOrugTXr1fb49GyEn5OJ9mjrZJ8Kpb0d5-H28PT-70Lo2rIRK7vOg__/Superman_vs_Goku_by_Chris_Supernerd.jpg

/thread

 

[Eon]

yea p much

 

[Delusional]

Snip

I didn't say Goku could win, I'm just saying you were giving him too little credit

 

[macdaddymario]

I'm 11 pages in to this now, and I just need to mention 2 things I haven't seen yet.. they said they were taking into account movies as well. Goku used IT as movement speed against Meta Cooler. First to move out of the way of his 'Super Nova' attack.. then to counter Cooler as he was also using IT as movement speed.

On the note of the 40 tons weights things.. he was in other world. King Kai's planet was 5x Earth's gravity.. so we MUST assume that it was the same at the least for the Grand Kai's planet, in fact I seem to recall it being said that it was actually 10x Earth's gravity there. This I could be wrong on and I would like someone to correct me if I am wrong, but that would mean it was more along the lines of 400 tons that ssj Goku has 0 problems moving at his training speed in. We don't know if it was his maximum speed so we can NOT argue that it was, we can only assume that he could have been moving even faster showing that he is much stronger then we know at that point.

EDIT: To remove an inaccurate edit.