Hope for diabetics

[Vegeta's Briefs]

I thank whomever does something worthy of thanks.

The kind in bacon is not bad. The kind in bacon grease isn't exactly what first-time dieters would use. And science was wrong, fat's not actually bad for you.

And you obviously don't, you're just too proud to admit it. John Atkins never said anything about stopping his diet after the first two weeks, unless he was talking about the first phase. You want to stop the first phase after the first two weeks. Note, first two weeks. And in his precious books, he says exactly what I said.

Now, are you through throwing a temper tantrum, or shall I call in an admin to deal with it?

 

[Eon]

So if fat isn't bad...then what clogs artirries that provoke heart attacks?
FAt is harmful, bacon has fat, I'm sure you can eat bacon, but downing and proving gluttony or just tearing it apart will eventually get to you, bacon fat/grease causes diarrhea (SP?) thats bad... I think..

*EDIT* to prevent being a hypocrite to my earlier post, I'll say my opinion on the atkins diet
do it if you want low carbs, try it for two weeks, and quit, I'm convinced two weeks should be the max you do it...although I'm not familiar with diets...never been on one...

 

[Vegeta's Briefs]

Yes, bacon grease is bad for you. So is too much salt and spice. I never said it wasn't. I said that bacon itself isn't bad for you. And most grease-fats are bad. I never said they weren't. Olive Oil is what people should use to help reduce the grease-fats. But normal food fats aren't. Atkins has proven it with extended testing. Things such as butter are perfectly fine for you, so long as you don't put half a stick on one piece of toast.

Gluttony is never good for you.

 

[SailorAlea]

*smirk*

Here is a document from the United States Department of Health. It specifically says to limit the fat intake found in BACON, butter, lard, coconut oil, fatty meats, sausages, cream/cheese, chocolate, all fried foods, hamburgers, etc. Look for yourself.

You can't refute the US Department of Health as a source without some other scientific proof.

Sorry, your "Oh, but I know it is! Fat isn't bad! Because my Aunt said so!" Just isn't going to cut it this time.

 

[Vegeta's Briefs]

Atkins is part of that health thing, and he says otherwise, and it's made my father ten times healthier than he was eating on *your* diet. So...

Atkins already did. But, oh wait, he even scientifically proved it, for you people who are obsessed with that sort of thing. 7 years testing, in fact.

My aunt didn't say so. I have enough physical proof right here in my household. I'm sorry, but you're going to need to actually check this thing out this time around.

 

[SailorAlea]

http://www.health.qld.gov.au/ActiveAte/documents/13784.pdf

There's the link. Sorry about that. Your "physical proof" means NOTHING because you can't see inside people's arteries, CAN YOU? Nope.

 

[Vegeta's Briefs]

But the doctors can, and judging by them, it's all fine and dandy. Better than ever, in fact.

 

[SailorAlea]

By the way, the American Heart Assosciation, (If you didn't know, the people who are experts in Heart Disease) have condemned the Atkins diet. You can look it up on news websites or in any search engine.

Did you know that Atkins died of a heart attack by any chance?

Here's just one website, but this isn't the official article by the AHA.

http://suewidemark.netfirms.com/atkinsdiet_aha.htm

 

[Vegeta's Briefs]

Oh yeah, and most diabetics as well as many health-nuts are praising the Atkins diet because it actually works.

Read the above results.

Now, I'll state it again: It doesn't work for all people, but the only results I've seen of the Atkins diet (and the many people that have taken it) that weren't satisfactory was the fact that my mother didn't lose weight. She gained energy using the Atkins and managed to maintain her weight while doing exercises (which actually made her lose an extra five or six pounds, as well as trim her stomach).

And considering my father has maintained his blood sugar at normal for over a month now from the extra-high it was before, I'd say it works.


**edit** "Robert Atkins"?

If he died of a heart attack, then why did his wife claim otherwise on national television?

 

[SailorAlea]

Once again you're talking about the irrelevant drop in weight of your parents and irrelevant blood sugar level of your father. I'm talking about the dangers of the Atkins diet, which you seem to think are -so- healthy, and the dangers of saturated fat, which you don't seem to think are damaging, even though all of those articles about the "revelations of fat" say that Saturated fat, the type in bacon, IS HORRIBLE for you.

 

[Vegeta's Briefs]

Irrelevant? Considering it was because of the diet that he gained normal blood sugar and lost his weight, I'd say it's pretty relevant to this thread and to what I'm arguing. And grease-fats are bad for you, but the fat found in the bacon isn't. The fat found in pork isn't. The fat found in any form of grease is bad for you. But Atkins doesn't praise grease-fat, he praises the fats from solid and whole foods, such as Broccoli and Spinach, and Sausages and Hamburger Patties, and Beef and Chicken and Fish.

"A YEAR AGO, Atkins almost died when his heart stopped. Soon after he left the hospital, he appeared on NBC’s “Today” show to point out the cause of his heart problem was an infection — not coronary artery disease from his diet, as his critics had claimed.
“So what are they going to say now, that they know I don’t have any blockages? What are they going to say now, that this is an infectious disease? They’re going to have to say, ‘Oh, we could have — we should have kept our mouth shut,’” Atkins said on the show."


"A small study presented last November at an American Heart Association meeting showed that the Atkins diet helped people lose more weight over six months than did a low-fat diet — and that it did not raise cholesterol or blood fat."


**Edit** BTW, thanks for the links Alea. You really helped me... or rather, you helped yourself. I already knew.

Now, can we back on topic or what?

 

[SailorAlea]

Just because it was presented AT the American Heart Assosciation doesn't mean it was a study OF the American Heart Assosciation. Also, your cholestoral levels don't change significantly in the course of six months.

That's what the problem they have is, that no real long-term studies have been conducted. The longest one was a 5 year study conducted by the AHA itself, and it found over a 30% increase in the detrimental type of fat.

 

[SaiyanPrideXIX]

Alright...I'm beginning to get thoroughly fed up with the rudeness toward VB on this bloody forum. For god's sake, have some respect and quit your *****ing.

Alea, no offense...but outside of the DBZ Manga you're no more of an authority than anyone else on this forum is about the diet. And speaking personally, my girlfriend is a diabetic and has had some interesting results with the LA Weight Loss diet--but I have a good friend whose whole family eats according the the Atkins diet. A family of overweight, unhealthy people. People who used to sleep until 5 in the afternoon when going to bed at 8 the night before. People who seldom got up to do basic things because they had no obligations forcing them to exert themselves to do so. And now, not 3 weeks into the Atkins Diet, they are all losing weight and full of pep, too much energy to even consider it being unhealthy and a fluke.

All I know is, study this and study that, VB said the diet has helped her father. I don't give a **** about the diet's integrity and neither does anyone else here, and you're being disrespectful. Just because it isn't "fux u lklololkol u r masd laammmeee looll kthx bye" doesn't mean it's any less flaming or rude.

Flaming intelligently does not make it okay...and being stand-offish with others due to your own personal reasons is impolite and uncalled for.

As far as VB's point of view goes vs. Alea's...well not to be a jerk, Alea, but I'll believe it when I see it, and I see good things from the diet as of right now. Different people's bodies react differently; your report argument holds no grounds over VB's family health, which she is seeing first hand. And not every man is created equally; that would include two separate diabetics doing the same thing, as they are fully capable of getting differing results.

Either way...I'd appreciate a tonal recoil here.

 

[Death Biscuit]

A friend of mine has been on the Atkin's diet for about a month now, and appears to have lost truckloads of weight. From what I've observed of him, though, it seems like a pretty lazy diet (he's not very active.) It's basically an excuse to stuff himself full of greasy foods, while still doing sweet FA exercise.

All this crap about dieting . . . the guy needs to get off his ass and run around the block a few times. I think that goes for anyone who thinks the Atkin's diet is simply a great opportunity to eat good food, still lose weight, and not have to do anything inbetween.

 

[Optimus Prime]

It's great that the diet works and that your father is in such excellent condition . The problem is that this diet may have long-term health effects because there have never been long term studies. Ever heard the saying, what you do today might come back to you in 10 or 20 years? Lets face it, gorging yourself in saturated fats will slowly kill you. It will cause clotted blood vessels and who knows what else... But the fact is that excess saturated fats are bad for you in the long run.

 

[Vegeta's Briefs]

That's why you don't gourge (gorge). You get the traditional serving size, and then if you're hungry, you get half a serving more.

 

[Deverz]

Fat's still going to build up in anyone who uses this diet

 

[Sonic the Vampire]

Alright...I'm beginning to get thoroughly fed up with the rudeness toward VB on this bloody forum. For god's sake, have some respect and quit your *****ing.

http://forum.esforces.com/showthread.php?t=30671

Read. This will give you some idea of why Alea and I aren't in the best mood about VB and have little respect for her opinions. The rudeness flows both ways, friend.

Either way they are both going to end up getting warnings if it drags out.

 

[fryd4good]

Right, and there's a BIG difference between debating and being rude. As far as I can tell, it's still a debate. Most people have enough sense to stop when they sense it becoming bitter. Both of these people seem to have common sense (Er, well... yeah). So I think we can be confident noone's flaming just for the purpose of flaming.

 

[Deman]

Everything is bad if you get too much of it... EVERYTHING.

Be it Vitamin C, fat, liquor, cigs, protein, iron...

I don't really think a diet that focuses on just one thing and eliminates others is good in the long run... I'm sure that a balanced diet is much healthier in the long run...