Future Trunks UPL

[Skiwan]

The belt is extremely high remember, dbz characters have that tendancy, and no, trunks and goten were older than 15-16 before the end of dbz and gt is 10 years later.

 

[-Blaze-]

Let's listen to David, he knows what's the best for dbz characters, well at least he has perfectly learned the style of Toryiama.:laff:

 

[Super Veggeto]

i Still dont agree with you SV : ] i saw many pics of trunks with lots of folds styles, and folds are suppose to be inorganized

There is a difference between having inconsistent folding (more varaiety or how ever you spell it) and having them unorginized.
The way they are now is nothing based on reference nor looking like any DBZ pants for the matter, as I also said before the pants should be less baggy.

I know Ravven understood my crits, this one was for pointed for you though, I cant explane it any better but if you still disagree with the facts then it's all up to you.

Keep it up Ravven, also, a little question.
Are you aiming for Super DBZ's Trunks proportions? Cause the other ref you posted is actually great and you can base your proportions on that to make it more accurate.

and modeling them in a freestyle way is way more cool then replicating the ones from the pic

Folding differently wont make the model original by the way, and by the looks of it he's aiming for Cell-Shading, which is the closest style to achive the looks of the series, so I'm assuming he isnt going for anything stylish or cool in the original way, he's aiming to model Trunks the way he is.

 

[SS_gohan44]

this model is getting really well, but as others said the folds should be not like that

Hopefully this will help: http://spdbz.jp/character/trunks.html
Keep it up though, i like how its turning out so far.

i cant get the picture

 

[-Nataku-]

sv- i know its all up to me , this is my point of wiev and i will stick with it
you would maybe consider that raven has to model the folds in your way, what im trying to tell that the style he is going for isent diferent from the anime or manga, you maybe consider hes folds as wrong, but i consider them as a "touch" of hes style. Crits are crits... but i see some peoples are using this term to influence others at they work, if someone wont accept crits ( couse he s going for another style ) hes an ignorant. my opinions are based on some researches with various epsiodes , pics , games and movies i saw.
Your saying to model trunks how he is, but you gotta anwser how realy trunks is? you cant image the chara concept of trunks , and hes pants just becouse of 1 Daizenshu pic.. i based my opinions more then then just the series, where folds change whenever the characters moves, or even stands still. So modeling them in a diferent way, thoug not very much diferent from the akira styles is makking any bad.

 

[ShadyD]

http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/8408/db34pg078sl0.gif
http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/6244/db34pg079ek7.gif
http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/3315/db34pg089cm2.gif

Nataku
Manga > Anime

Research the manga and you'll see the folds are V - U shaped
Thats what SV meant anyway.
In any case, its up to Ravven to choose which style he will stick to.
Savvy?
Now lets end this crap about folds

 

[-Nataku-]

haha i got all the mangas, and the daizenshu books, calm dawn shadeh, We are having a friendly debate with SV we dont wanna argue, i know SV is a person that would rather not involve into a fight. I just wanna exchange opinions, Forum is the right place to do it. If we will learn to exchange opinions without emotions our debate will be a sucess. we all have the right to keep our opinion about something this is our mutual right : ] peace!

 

[ShadyD]

yeah but from the time i've been here i learned that hese things.. well.. it will end up in a slight flame war and this thread will be closed before it evolves even further.
Tho I guess you and SV arent really that agressive/competant to let it come so far. I still think SV is right tho

 

[-Nataku-]

of course we arent!! <3 sv <3 shadeh
post update ravven will ya?!: ] from the things you said to me on the "GG" comunicator i know your realy involved in this trunks

 

[Super Veggeto]

you would maybe consider that raven has to model the folds in your way

My way? =P I think you mean the original Toriyama style?

what im trying to tell that the style he is going for isent diferent from the anime or manga, you maybe consider hes folds as wrong, but i consider them as a "touch" of hes style. Crits are crits... but i see some peoples are using this term to influence others at they work, if someone wont accept crits ( couse he s going for another style ) hes an ignorant.

Well I guess Toriyama and myself are ignorants ;p
Lets look at the facts, he didnt model the folds the way they originaly SHOULD look like if you follow the series/manga.
He went for his own taste, and I dont say it's bad, if Ravven will post that thats what he was going for I'm gonna drop that subject, but as you said, crits are crits, I pointed out one thing, you may disagree with it but it wont change that fact that they may be true.

No grudges of course, we're just having an adult conversation concerning the topic =]
Ravven, sorry if it pushes you or anything, didnt know my crits would make such a fuss xD but I know you'll figure it out eventualy so I'm lookin' forward to some updates. :smile:

 

[Ravven]

Don't worry SV you're not And here's update you wanted Nataku...

But I've made a few modifications to my model to it mach to the pic I posted and see if it will be better... So I had to do some major tweaks to his body, I have also almost completly remade pants. Oh he's not so much buffed now... And here's what I've got:

some wires:

And a lil sth to people who don't like ink'n'paint

C&C pls

So to tell the truth I think that it's up to modeler how to do folds... Nataku is right about Trunks having diffrent folds in some movies, anime, manga etc, etc... BUT SV is right about U shaped folds... So... Conclusion: you are both right and wrong at the same time... The modeler will decide it as always...
So U could both drop this subject... and comment on my model :laff:

Decide which one was better... this or the one I posted earlier...

 

[Skiwan]

It is a valid criticism, folds essentially follow rules, wether on manga, art, modeling, you cant just stick down a few folds and expect it to be correct, as with all things graphic, you must base it on some sort of former knowledge. In this case not only do you have to take into the account gravity, and points of tension (basis for how folds work) but style and also modeling use. To be fair the folds arent that bad, but they do look inconsistant with the above rules i've mentioned.

Woah, u posted while i was typing that =P sorry to bring it up again.

Its awesome man much better now, i only have one crit, the back of the heel shouldnt be so round, heels go more backwards than forwards due to bone structure, like this = /_ rather than |_ if you get what i mean, it keeps you balanced that way =P

 

[ShadyD]

Those hips and shoulders will collapse when you try to animate him.. You know that right?

 

[Super Veggeto]

Yay, big improvment man =] folds look much better including the proportions too.
Just take Davids advice about the heels and Shady's advice about the deformations ^_^

 

[Ravven]

Woah, u posted while i was typing that =P sorry to bring it up again.

np man

... i only have one crit, the back of the heel shouldnt be so round, heels go more backwards than forwards due to bone structure, like this = /_ rather than |_ if you get what i mean

I'm not sure, but are you thinking about the back of the boots ??

Those hips and shoulders will collapse when you try to animate him.. You know that right?

Okay, now I have no idea what are you talking about... I will post some wires and better angles shoot of shoulders becouse I have also some problems with them, so then maybe some1 can help me... But I don't know how to improve this hips area (don't know what are hips ^^ u know I'm polish ;D) So if some1 could explane or do a lil drawover how to fix it It would be great...

 

[-Nataku-]

ok im droping the subject too : ] i luv the folds now , and try to add as much details as posible!

 

[ShadyD]

I suck at explaining stuff =(

Okay basicly, you gotta have an extra row of polys for the shoulders to deform properly and you gotta have a hip-shape so the hips wont collapse when he kicks or something.
http://www.poopinmymouth.com/process/tips/shoulder_deform.jpg

the 2nd pic in the following animation is what i mean
http://www.poopinmymouth.com/process/tips/limb_deformations.gif

It collapses when it goes on too far but since the shoulder needs to be able to rotate in almost every way you should use that.

 

[Ravven]

Okay I got the hips area And I hope that this is how it's supposed to look:

front:

back:

I didn't get tho how to do the shoulders area... So I'm posting some wires... And I know guys that this is a mess... so... if u could do me a drawover also for this part from ShadyD how to make it good... It would be grat ;]

Ok images:

I'm counting on you guys...

 

[-Nataku-]

well the polys look clean for me, i would remade the ares that are made by quads, but the quads are a little deformed, you got a few polys like that here and there : ] but still your going very fine!

 

[Ravven]

ok guys, this week im going on training camp to another city... so no posting from me until next monday... I hope that when I get back I'll finish this Trunks Oh and If have some crits write them and I'll check them when I'm back