STEAM IS SO ***

[Sonic the Vampire]

Well I had an extremely long response to Cuc but the forum ate it when I tried to send it so, so much for that.

I'll summarize, real fast and dirty.

Cuc, it isn't like we don't know most users are still on dial up, it's that they're a dwindling majority. Relatively quickly broadband is going to take narrow band's place as the most frequently carried connection used in online games. Not too long after that it will likely take over as the vast majority of connected gamers and then this outcrying will die down.

Broadband isn't all that expensive anymore. For 20 bucks you can hook yourself up with some basic DSL. For 30 bucks you can hook yourself up with some faster DSL or basic cable (model excluded). If you take out 10 dollars a month for a 56k connection and possibly much more for a second phoneline (if that's the route you took) it is not a huge jump in price. Broadband users are unhappy about seeing the progress of online games be retarded by 33.6 and 56k users and they get excited about applications that are designed to take advantage of their connection speed. Now I know not everybody can get broadband where they live, but they are a fairly small minority, and that will not be as true over the next few years and broadband continues to take off.

56k and ISDN are great, but Broadband has a lot more potential for its users, and if you factor in the fact that the majority of broadband users are capitalists then you can understand that you get what you pay for. Want to pay 10 dollars for 56k? Get 10 dollars worth of service. You can still play, but you're going to have to upgrade to gain access to all of the features you want.

It isn't an issue of wanting 56kers to go away, it's that we want to get what we pay for, and we've paid for a faster connection that we want to see more use made of. Programs like Steam can offer that up to us in exchange for pissing on a few 33.6k users who will have all the difficulty in the world trying to update games and the like due to the bandwidth requirements of Steam. I feel bad about those slower users, but I also think it's about time somebody designed a program that caters to broadband users without spending all of their time worrying about how slower modems will handle the load.

 

[Ultraq]

getting what you pay for sounds like fair, but screwing others because they paid less isn't.
when you buy half-life from a store, the minimum requirments on the back of the box say 28k (not even 56!). when you pay for the ability to play on 28k, you should get it.

you (or rather, valve) can/should make steam get the most of broadband while still giving 56kers a fair deal.
look at half-life 2, they are trying to get the most out of DX9 (and even DX10 I think) while still giving dx7 and dx6 users a fairly good experience.

same should go for steam .. imho.
but .. WON is still there. I hope 56kers get a better support from steam when WON dies.

I was a 56ker once, I know how bad it is :/ and well, I don't know how steam runs on a 56k line but, when i was on 56k my avarage ping was 350-400. There isn't much you can do for a 56k line, it's not like you can make it download faster. the only thing you can do is not scrweing it up more than it's already scrwed.

 

[DiebytheSword]

. . . . it's that they're a dwindling majority.

We/They are still the majority. Unfortunately for you, that stuffs that argument right there. Digging deeper, I should point out that the marketers of the gaming companies disagree with you. Look at Sony, who has decided to segregate not only those with online PS2s as opposed to those who don't, but those who have broadband and those who have narrowband. X Box has a similar model.

Why won't this work on the PC?

. . . because a vast majority still exsists waiting for a game that has netcode as neatly streamlined as Quake 1.

Relatively quickly broadband is going to take narrow band's place as the most frequently carried connection used

The facts here go against you. The most optimistic veiw is that broadband will outpace narrowband in 10 years. 10 years. That's like writing programs that we play today based on machines running in the early 90s. Anyone for 1 ms latency Doom? Thought not. The fact that the phone companys slow down the whole show by not allowing other ISPs to offer bb connections on their lines dramatically slows even that estimate.

And getting what you pay for? Broadband is cheaper to transmit than Analog . . . your paying for their network expansion projects.

 

[Pcjoe]

What a pain in the ass :-/, when I'm in a gaming company I'll still have to be coding optimizations for dail up users -_-
Going to be funny how large the gap is going to be though. Dail up users downoading at 5 KB/s, then broadband users downloading at 50 mbps

 

[DiebytheSword]

I agree Joe. But facts are facts, all the Bell Phone companies (including Bell Atlantic/Verizon) refuse any non-bell access to their lines. AT&T is just as stingy. That is number 1 and 2 in the market place for DSL. Following in distant third is MCI/Worldcom/UUNet. None of these companies are willing to spread DSL quickly because DSL only works on copper. All three companies have been spending time and money (last decade and billions of dollars) to convert to Fi-Op. When you have 100% of either type of line, DSL or Fi-Op (t1) will spread across the nation (thus broadband, as Cable will be too burdened if it becomes widespread). Unfortunately that is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do quickly or effeciently. 802.11g is more likely to spread everywhere first, and the FCC will likely stab them in the ass everywhere they go.

Anyway you look at it, a permanent, fast spreading broadband solution is far off at the very best. The huge cities may have many options, but most rural areas don't even have one acceptable one.

 

[Sonic the Vampire]

I wasn't trying to give off the impression that game designers should abandon 56kers, I just said I was happy that we've got at least one program that is seemingly designed from the ground up to take advatage of our extra bandwidth. I'd also double check that 10 year statistics in a couple of years; broadband users started dropping off due to high costs a couple of years back but they've started to stack up again. Your estimate may be an older one.

 

[Pain]

if the estimate includes non-gamers (older people probably) than of course 56k will dominate.... what the hell do they need cable for when they dont use the internet for much?

i think that if you look at a gaming comunity it would probably be a closer race.

 

[Halorin]

I've read most of the posts, and while I won't add in my own long and drawn out take on Steam, I will say this.

1) Steam is in Beta form. There's bugs? REALLY!? Who'd have thought you might have a bug in Beta form.

2) I use Steam and I have no problems. I know a few people who do with DoD, but nothing they haven't fixed by firing some neurons in their brain at the issue.

3) Whining on a forum isn't going to change Valve's mind, so what exactly do you feel you're accomplishing by trying to put down Steam.

If you don't like it, then by all means don't use it, but understand on what you're missing out on at the same time. Stop whining because you might actually have to do some tinkering to get something to work. I can't believe people are really that lazy. "I have to install something again to play a game? I'll just quit playing the game, then." WOW is all I have to say about people like that.

Whatever. I actually hope a lot of HL players quit because of Steam, because while it pisses me off too sometimes, there's that many idiots and half-assed typing noobs that I won't have to worry about. That in itself is benefit enough for me.

 

[Sonic the Vampire]

Come on Hal, we're trying to work on attacking the argument, not the people behind the argument. That's the whole purpose of a public forum: Communication. That last comment borders on flaming the same people you just attempted to discredit as well. Try to be a little more subtle in these kinds of posts from now on. I know where you're coming from you're just hitting the nail on the head a little too hard.

 

[KilledWithStyle]

I do not insult steam (allthough my sig says diffrent, I just thought it was funny), but It does seem to play around with you. It does fix problems faster than WON does. We are stuck with many bugs like downloading server passwords and easy crashing.
I just dont like it cause it takes up much memory.

If a update stops, just restart steam about 3 times. Then let it run. If it continues keep doing it until it works. I had to do this the first time I ran Steam.

 

[Gourmet]

Steam is okay, at the beginning i had some problems with starting Steam, and so on. One of my problems where that it felt like Steam was fragile, and weak, but if u dont mess with it and take ur time when u start it for the first time, its all gonna be fine. Thats what happened for me, and Steam is very much less buggy than WON, my friends. Once u get in-game, there is a 8/10 chance (at the moment) that it will crash, buddy. And thoes odds WILL change as Steam gets more, and more patches, do not fear.

 

[Morpherex]

I like steam now. At first there were tons of problems. Then they toned down a bit and they fixed them. Then I got the "Your cd key is invalid" crap. But the fix they did about 3 or 4 weeks ago fixed that completly for me, I have no problems now.

I also agree on the fact that it is better for broadband. It's just a nother reason for people to get broadband and out of the stone ages.

 

[Gourmet]

I like steam now. At first there were tons of problems. Then they toned down a bit and they fixed them. Then I got the "Your cd key is invalid" crap. But the fix they did about 3 or 4 weeks ago fixed that completly for me, I have no problems now.

I also agree on the fact that it is better for broadband. It's just a nother reason for people to get broadband and out of the stone ages.

I agree totaly, my friend. Listen to him, he's right!

 

[[RaideN]]

Well if you all think steam is so great... get esf on steam and play with the few.. what .. 15 people that do!

 

[Mr. Satans]

I hated STEAM until I actually got it and tried it, I LOVE IT, the only thing is that ESF is lacking in STEAM servers

 

[ssjFajita]

Hell yes, ESF is lacking STEAM servers and we need more ESF STEAM players. I can recognize most of the people that play with me

 

[Smith|]

look at half-life 2, they are trying to get the most out of DX9 (and even DX10 I think) while still giving dx7 and dx6 users a fairly good experience.

Nope, Half life 2 will only be using Direct X 9.0 as 10 hasn't even been produced yet, and isn't hardly developed enough to use =\.

Even 9.1 isn't out yet.

 

[imported_bobmundo123]

need cd key

 

[Hibiki]

u also need a warning for that

dont ask for warez

 

[imported_bobmundo123]

need spare cd key