Scientists Create Chimera

[J-Dude]

I do not fear God, I respect and worship him and his word. It is because of him that man has it's qualms and opinions of good and evil, right and wrong. It's also inherited his creativity. Right now you're sounding like Dr. Breen in Half Life 2 or something. You can make as much logical sense as you want, and many will believe you, but I always follow what's in my heart's best interest, and this isn't it.

...You do remember Dr. Breen's first speech in HL2, right?

"First, let us consider the fact that for the first time, ever, as a species, immortality is in our reach. This simple fact has far-reaching implications. It requires radical rethinking and revision of our genetic imperatives. It also requires planning and forethought that run in direct opposition to our neural presets. I find it helpful in times like these to remind myself that our true enemy, is instinct. Insinct was our mother when we were and infant species. Instinct coddled us and kept us safe in those hard scrabbled years when we hardened our sticks and cooked our first meals above a meager fire and darted at the shadows that leapt upon the cavern's walls. But inseperable from isntinct is it's dark twin, superstition. Instinct is inextricably bound to unreasoning impulses. And today we clearly see it's true nature. Instinct has just become aware, of it's irrelevence. And like a cornered beast, it will not go down without a bloody fight. It would inflict a fatal injury on our species. Instinct creates it's own oppressors, and bids us rise up against them. Instinct tells us that the unknown is a threat, rather than an opportunity. Instinct slyly and covertly compels us away from from change and progress, and therefore, must be expunged. It must be foguth tooth and nail, beginning with the basest of human urges, the urge to reproduce. We should thank our benefactors for giving us respite from this overpowering force. They have thrown a switch and exorcised our demons in a single stroke. They have given us the strength we never could have summoned to overcome this compulsion. They have given us purpose, they have turned our eyes toward the stars."

Huh...all that seemed to make sense didn't it? But in the end, it was all crap. Sorry, but I'm sticking with the one thing in this world I can rightly turn to: my faith.

 

[Zeonix]

I do not fear God, I respect and worship him and his word. It is because of him that man has it's qualms and opinions of good and evil, right and wrong. It's also inherited his creativity. Right now you're sounding like Dr. Breen in Half Life 2 or something. You can make as much logical sense as you want, and many will believe you, but I always follow what's in my heart's best interest, and this isn't it.

...You do remember Dr. Breen's first speech in HL2, right?

"First, let us consider the fact that for the first time, ever, as a species, immortality is in our reach. This simple fact has far-reaching implications. It requires radical rethinking and revision of our genetic imperatives. It also requires planning and forethought that run in direct opposition to our neural presets. I find it helpful in times like these to remind myself that our true enemy, is instinct. Insinct was our mother when we were and infant species. Instinct coddled us and kept us safe in those hard scrabbled years when we hardened our sticks and cooked our first meals above a meager fire and darted at the shadows that leapt upon the cavern's walls. But inseperable from isntinct is it's dark twin, superstition. Instinct is inextricably bound to unreasoning impulses. And today we clearly see it's true nature. Instinct has just become aware, of it's irrelevence. And like a cornered beast, it will not go down without a bloody fight. It would inflict a fatal injury on our species. Instinct creates it's own oppressors, and bids us rise up against them. Instinct tells us that the unknown is a threat, rather than an opportunity. Instinct slyly and covertly compels us away from from change and progress, and therefore, must be expunged. It must be foguth tooth and nail, beginning with the basest of human urges, the urge to reproduce. We should thank our benefactors for giving us respite from this overpowering force. They have thrown a switch and exorcised our demons in a single stroke. They have given us the strength we never could have summoned to overcome this compulsion. They have given us purpose, they have turned our eyes toward the stars."

Huh...all that seemed to make sense didn't it? But in the end, it was all crap. Sorry, but I'm sticking with the one thing in this world I can rightly turn to: my faith.

Thanks for getting this thread closed.

 

[J-Dude]

Your welcome.

 

[Smith]

Since the majority of the people posting here are not defying Opti's friendly warning, I'm just going to make an example of the few who do. Here's a warning, J-Dude. You're also forbidden to post here for the remainder of the thread.

Also, Zeonix, don't post things like "Thanks for getting this thread closed." It certainly doesn't help.

EDIT: What will these new sheep be called? Sheeple?

 

[Chakra-X]

EDIT: What will these new sheep be called? Sheeple?

omgsh

Please no. I heard that from somewhere, don't remember exactly when, just something tells me not to call them that.

I say.

"Peeps".

Yep. Peeps.

omgsh 2: I didn't know that was Zeonix =O

@Chakra: Mental retardation has to do with the brain, this cannot easily be changed with organ donors. Unless you are seriously suggesting to genetically engineer a human baby. You can't insert a couple of human cells into someone hoping that they will regenerate and live again, organ failure is much more than just a couple of cells that stop working.
AIDS won't become something of the past, it's a disease that destroys the immune system, once it's destroyed, it won't come back (as far as I know), you can only use extra medication to fortify whatever is left of your immune system.

If finding a cure for a man made virus is so easy, we would have cures for nearly every disease that is known so far. Just because some human made something, doesn't mean you can easily cure it. Definitely if the virus can mutate (which most can, take the flue for example)

Last but not least, we never said that it was simple to genetically engineer. We say that it is possible, as said before, we never thought we would make such a devastating weapon such as the A-bomb.

Well I meant genetically monitoring an infant in the womb of the mother to look for any signs that the baby would be mentally retarded, fidn those signs, and genetically alter it so it wouldn't be. A bit weird yes, but I would gladly let a doctor correct the baby's genetics if it was said to be born with such an extreme defect.

By no more AIDS I mean with advanced knowledge of genetics, there would have so be come good comming from this that would be used to fight it.

A Human-made virus may not be easy to cure, but it will certainly have flaws. And I am not talking about now, as in the near future, I mean when it gets to the point that people start making advanced diseases, the other side is that the knowledge of curing diseases would be increased too.

You may be right about how we never even fathomed a bomb that could level a city that could actually work in real life, but I just think this is more complex since it involves organisms.

 

[Almighty_Gir]

J-dude, if you have EVER taken ANY form of medicine, then your right to preach faith and claim modern medicine is heretical, is now gone.

 

[DaRkOwNs]

dont argue with him idiot, hes been banned from speaking. its not cool to argue with someone who cant argue back.

we may not be able to counter act AIDS with genetic engineering. if you know how it works youll know that aids is a constantly evolving virus that changes to work around immunizations and our immune system.

there have literally been thousands of cures for AIDS and HIV, but the virus evolves around them so quickly its renderred completely useless

 

[Smith]

dont argue with him idiot, hes been banned from speaking. its not cool to argue with someone who cant argue back.

That could've been said a little more bluntly >. Let's just forget all this religion mumbo-jumbo and get back on-topic! This thread doesn't have to be closed.

Please no. I heard that from somewhere, don't remember exactly when, just something tells me not to call them that.

South Park.

 

[Almighty_Gir]

sorry, didn't see the whole "banned for speaking" thing... which i disagree with anyway, but what's done, is done.

religious debates should be ok... i know they are against the rules, but i would like to think this forum is growing up enough to be reasonable in their arguments.

 

[Smith]

religious debates should be ok... i know they are against the rules, but i would like to think this forum is growing up enough to be reasonable in their arguments.

I do too, but Opti put down his foot, and I'm only following suit.

Also, yes, Sheeple is now what I will be calling these mutants!

 

[frsrblch]

Fear is the mind-killer, J-Dude. Combine fear, one's imagination and ignorance, and you're more dangerous than any scientist to have ever walked the face of the Earth. It is fear of a higher being, fear of change/progress, and fear of the unknown that has done the most damage to to humanity; not some dude in a lab trying to find a way to make animals organ donors.

QFMFT

...andomgwtfitszeonix!

we may not be able to counter act AIDS with genetic engineering. if you know how it works youll know that aids is a constantly evolving virus that changes to work around immunizations and our immune system.

I don't think genetic engineering is the solution to HIV. What we need are nanoprobes, brought to you by the wonders of nanotechnology! Then we can make Borg Sheeple (really, Sheeple? I think you're giving the furries ideas) to conquer the world in the name of atheism.

 

[Sicron]

I don't think genetic engineering is the solution to HIV. What we need are nanoprobes, brought to you by the wonders of nanotechnology! Then we can make Borg Sheeple (really, Sheeple? I think you're giving the furries ideas) to conquer the world in the name of atheism.

Oh noes! Sheeple...s...are taking of the world!

*cough* I just had to make that... *cough*

 

[Brim]

Fear is the mind-killer, J-Dude. Combine fear, one's imagination and ignorance, and you're more dangerous than any scientist to have ever walked the face of the Earth. It is fear of a higher being, fear of change/progress, and fear of the unknown that has done the most damage to to humanity; not some dude in a lab trying to find a way to make animals organ donors.

That statement is pretty far off IMO.

Fear is a good thing. Fear is what keeps you in check when you're messing with some serious ****. Those who do not fear and respect that with which they tamper are bound to take their subject matter too lightly. Scientists in their labs have done countless times more damage to the Earth/Human population than the suspicious or frightened and imaginative public. It is not fear of change/progress that has done harm, but lack of fear. The thought process that man has "mastered" anything that he has accomplished. The ego and hubris behind the thinking that scientists always know how best to use the research they are performing is astounding, and it is present in just about every lab today. Are you going to tell me that every single scientist out there doing research knows the best application for their research in the grand scheme of things? No, more than likely (though not always the case) they are thinking about their own fame and fortune. How is this research going to put them on the map.

Science has a problem with being able to do things long before we understand why we should or should not do them. My request is that we slow down and make sure what we are doing isn't going to **** us in the future. You guys can be first in line for your metal legs, that's fine with me, just don't ***** when your augmentations and implants start ****ing with your whole biology.


And genetic engineering won't do **** for AIDS. AIDS is not a genetic disease, you have to contract AIDS and that is usually done by ****ing some dirty snatch.

 

[Zeonix]

I suppose we shouldn't research anything if it feels wrong. Fear is an emotion and arises quite easily in those who have a lack of understanding of whatever it is they fear. To allow an emotion to hold back human civilization as a whole is reprehensible. Yes, fear has its uses. It can save your life as a child (I didn't put my head into a pot of boiling water because I feared being burned). It can also be used to control the masses, or as an excuse to do so. However, once you reach adulthood, that fear should be replaced by knowledge (After all, fear is caused by ignorance or a lack of information. You can argue that if you truly understand something or it's capabilities, like a nuke let's say, you'd fear it. I don't agree, but that changes from person to person.) Knowledge is power kiddies.

We do not believe we've mastered everything that we've accomplished. If we did, we'd stop trying to improve ourselves and our technology. We'd believe we have gone as far as humans can possibly go, and go about living complacent lives until we die out. This isn't the case.

Are you telling me that every single scientist knows nothing about the possible effects and repercussion's of his/her actions? That all scientists are inept, are just in the field for fame and fortune? Some may consider me to be a pessimist, but even I have more faith in mankind than that.

It is impossible for scientists to foresee every possibility when trying something new. When something is needed *now*, waiting around for the next 10 years isn't an option. However, the *now* scenario doesn't apply to this particular article. They are taking it slow. If that weren't true, would we not see people being given sheep organs? When entering a new frontier, it is important to take things slowly, but to say that scientists in all fields should slow down because you're scared of what may happen is asinine at best.

 

[Devion]

Oh noes! Sheeple...s...are taking of the world!

*Image of Shurg* (Human/Sheep/Borg >;o)

*cough* I just had to make that... *cough*

\o

That one is awesome, thanks for the laugh, haha.

I think this is great development, this really could resolve problems regarding to shortage of organ donors. There isn't a sensible argument against this development.

It's good to criticize it, but bashing it is rediculous. And not too get religious, but if we dont play god, then who will?

 

[Eon]

Haven't read recent posts, but as far as some people saying humans have been on earth and created a certain way and have stayed that way, and should stay that way is a bit...eh..

all I have to say is...

the appendix

naturally changed over time, doesn't work anymore.

[Correct me if I'm wrong] but I do believe there was an old dominant gene of a 6th finger for humans? meh

 

[frsrblch]

Fear is a good thing. Fear is what keeps you in check when you're messing with some serious ****. Those who do not fear and respect that with which they tamper are bound to take their subject matter too lightly.

Fear and caution are two different things. Anyone with the knowledge to deal with "serious ****" knows enough to treat it with respect.

Scientists in their labs have done countless times more damage to the Earth/Human population than the suspicious or frightened and imaginative public. It is not fear of change/progress that has done harm, but lack of fear.

There is no question that modern technology has caused harm, and will cause more harm in the future, but when measured against the immeasurable effect it has had on the quality of our lives, any damage done is near insignificant. And you can trace that chain of harm all the way back to the dawn of agriculture. Being able to produce more food from less land led to higher population densities, and a sedentary lifestyle, which, when coupled with animal domestication, led to the spread of epidemic diseases from animals to humans. Almost every epidemic disease that has ever plagued man can be traced to an animal ancestor, and if we hadn't stopped being hunters and gatherers, nobody would ever have died of any of them. Of course, that means that we would all still be hunters and gatherers, and the leading cause of death would still be murder, rather than old age or unhealthy lifestyle. Every advance following our transition from hunters and gatherers has caused bad with good, but the good has always outweighed the bad. To stop now because of the same fearful opposition science has faced all along would be stupid if nothing else.

On the other hand, people fearing that which they do not understand has taken it's toll in millions upon millions of people killed. There is still genocide going on in Africa, and Europe has a fairly dark past of it's own. People are killing and raping other people, simply for who they are. I believe that that hatred stems from a lack of understanding, which fuels the same fear people have of progress. Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

Would you be willing to give up everything we have ever achieved as a civilization to avoid the evils of technology? Or would you rather arbitrarily draw a line in the sand and say "this far, no further." The problem with doing so would of course be that we would never know where those paths would take us. Genetic research could lead to genetic abominations (or whatever it is you fear from it), or it could lead to happier, healthier, longer-living people, and it is impossible to say where it will lead us until we get there. And we will get there, as fear has yet to manage to stop anything. All it has ever done is slow it down progress until either somebody did it anyway, and proved it wasn't evil, or you all changed your minds and decided it wasn't as evil as not moving forward.

 

[Skiwan]

Fear is a good thing. Fear is what keeps you in check when you're messing with some serious ****. Those who do not fear and respect that with which they tamper are bound to take their subject matter too lightly. Scientists in their labs have done countless times more damage to the Earth/Human population than the suspicious or frightened and imaginative public. It is not fear of change/progress that has done harm, but lack of fear. The thought process that man has "mastered" anything that he has accomplished. The ego and hubris behind the thinking that scientists always know how best to use the research they are performing is astounding, and it is present in just about every lab today. Are you going to tell me that every single scientist out there doing research knows the best application for their research in the grand scheme of things? No, more than likely (though not always the case) they are thinking about their own fame and fortune. How is this research going to put them on the map.

Science has a problem with being able to do things long before we understand why we should or should not do them. My request is that we slow down and make sure what we are doing isn't going to **** us in the future. You guys can be first in line for your metal legs, that's fine with me, just don't ***** when your augmentations and implants start ****ing with your whole biology.

I partially agree, but all of your first statement is purely opinion, and I think you've totally ignored the fact of how science really does develop. The most important scientific discovery's are often completely overlooked at the time, and only later on, the past knowledge is required to be put to good use. Countless experiments can look like they amount to nothing, but take a look again twenty, fifty, maybe a couple of hundred years later and past research will be just as important as anything they might do now and usually is required. I also must remind you that many scientists who did damage the world as you say, were doing it because they were forced to look into such things, by people who were in power because of fear of change. Not only this, but the scientists are rarely the ones who even get to the point of applying their newly discovered research, the government decides how it should be used. Scientists are rarely the ones who you can blame, their thirst for knowledge is all they're guilty for, its what people and governments decide to do which is the problem.

You know there are many things genetics can be used for, my friend who's doing a degree in chemistry, and bio chemistry has told me many things which personally I think are amazing developments. Such as, organisms are the most efficient machines on the planet, no man made machine will ever be as efficient and produce less waste, he told me about how it may be perfectly possible to "grow" resources or fuels or even just energy. There's already ways of being able to grow plastic. He's told me loads of things, half i cant even being to understand, but i know when I heard them I was amazed at the possibilities. It's not all organ growing meat shops that may come from genetic engineering, it could be the best source for a better world, and to stamp your foot down now before we've actually started researching and discovering the possibilities that may lay ahead is foolish and arrogant. Personally I think morality isn't even an issue, until they start messing around with actual human development, maybe toying with animals isn't a good thing to do, but this is survival of the fittest and as far as i'm concerned we're at the top of the food chain (as arrogant as that might sound), and there's nothing more natural than that.