Half-Life 2 Flaws in general.

[Sonic the Vampire]

You know what pride? Valve JUST left in the bugs INTENTIONALLY to **** with you. They thought, "most of the world we'll be fine, we'll just **** up a few computers for fun" and they went out and did it, just to spite you. That's the message you seem to be sending out, anyway.

You realize if you hadn't been unlucky enough to have a combonation of system components that lead to glitches in HL2 you wouldn't have a leg to stand on with all of your complaining. 95% of your arguments center around your own computer screwing up, which only means that valve didn't manage to design all of their high end next gen graphical effect crap to work perfectly on every sound card/video card/mobo combonation. I can positively 100% guarentee you that there are people out there who can't play Doom 3 because of some glitchy screw ups that id couldn't have predicted ahead of time, but you don't experience them so they don't matter to you.

A lot of people are having issues, and valve will fix those issues because valve really isn't out to get you, they're out to get your money, and it's easier to get your money if they can sell you a working product.

 

[Kurt`]

1. 6 years in development, 12 hours of gameplay??

Only took me about 7 hours. :\

And yes, the sound stuttering bug was very bad when I played. I played in 800x600 with everything maxed.

I don't get ANY sound in Doom 3, so I can't really compare. I'll have to wait a year or so before I can even play that masterpiece with sound.

 

[Soulicro]

*figured I should add this -
MAKE A BACKUP OF ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING YOU CHANGE OR MODIFY

I get the feeling you people think the audio stutters is actually audio related. Most of the time, it isnt; it is caused by the game loading information on the fly, mostly textures and graphics than audio. The new command they put in the patch made the textures load onto your video card's memory, thus improving stuttering on some machines and making things worse on others. Here are three commands you should probably add in to your config (and make it read only so this will actually stay in) if youre experiencing stuttering:

cl_forcepreload 1
sv_forcepreload 1
mat_compressedtextures 1


I figured by the name of them you'll realize what each does - first one forces preload on entire 'server,' the second forcing a preload on everything on the clients side, and the third uses compressed textures. To reduce main menu loading times, add this into your command line. Now, its advised youll add it in through Steam, seeing as it will take effect everything you run HL2 from anywhere on your computer. To add the next command line through Steam, all you have to do is load up steam - My Games - right click on half life 2 - properties - launch options. Add this in there:

-console

This will get rid of the active bg, reducing loading times. If you want to speed up things even further, find "valve.avi" in your blahblahblah\half-life 2\hl2\media\ directory and delete it. Now make a new text file and rename it to Valve.avi (not Valve.avi.txt!!), and make it read only. This will disable the startup valve animation, reducing loading times even further.
Another command to add in the same place is

-heapsize xxxx

This command tells Half Life 2 to allocate more RAM to the game system heap, where it can be accessed by the game to improve performance by storing more game information in RAM and hence reducing loading pauses

xxxx should be half of the RAM you have, in kilobytes, for example 128000 if youve got 256MB, 510000 if youve got 1 gig, etc. The default is 64, so I recommend changing it.

Also, on the Steam forums someone found something rather odd - if you set hl2.exe to LOW priority instead of high, it reduces stutters - tleast for some people. Obviously make sure you dont have a lot of other things running in the background, since GPU will be sent to them first. Seems odd, and while it works for some it doesnt for others. Try it out.

Thats it for now. If I see/hear/find anything else I'll probably just edit this post. Good night

 

[Navanax]

To add the next command line through Steam, all you have to do is load up steam - My Games - right click on half life 2 - properties - launch options. Add this in there:

-console

This will get rid of the active bg, reducing loading times. If you want to speed up things even further, find "valve.avi" in your blahblahblah\half-life 2\hl2\media\ directory and delete it. Now make a new text file and rename it to Valve.avi (not Valve.avi.txt!!), and make it read only. This will disable the startup valve animation, reducing loading times even further.
Another command to add in the same place is

-heapsize xxxx

This command tells Half Life 2 to allocate more RAM to the game system heap, where it can be accessed by the game to improve performance by storing more game information in RAM and hence reducing loading pauses

xxxx should be half of the RAM you have, in kilobytes, for example 128000 if youve got 256MB, 510000 if youve got 1 gig, etc. The default is 64, so I recommend changing it.

Sounds like a good trick, I'm gonna try that when I get home

And for the discussion, I'm with Phatslugga and Sonic all the way. 'nuff said

 

[Texas]

Yeah ive added those in, saw em on a site somewhere.

Oddly i never had any audio problems though Especially the heapsize one is very helpfull indeed

 

[SaiyanPrideXIX]

Well I just beat the game, so this will probably be a moot point, but I'll make it anyway.

I think a lot of people have this inside out, or bass-ackwards. Here's some facts:

The big bad source engine...is just the HL1 engine with all the parts of it that had limits deleted. It's not some great thing they built from the ground up, it's not some stripped-down-and-rebuilt god-like engine. It's just the same engine with Havok Physics plugged into it. They probably had to work harder to implement the physics into their SDK than anything else (because object textures determine weight and sound). "Four years perfecting the Source engine." Well, **** to that--the DX9 water shimmer could only have been implemented in the last year, and the same goes for the physics, which can't be older than the company that licensed them. Those are the two main features and we already know the physics part is at least a year old.

There is a thread with a HALF A MILLION VIEWS and 500 PAGES OF REPLIES on the steam forums called "Audio Stuttering." Now correct me if I'm wrong but if the game works great for you and you don't have this problem I doubt if you'd go onto the steam forum and view that thread. So we can logically assume that the vast majority of the people there are probably looking for a solution. The thread is also full of people who's first and only post on Steam's forum is in that thread, just to see if they can find a final solution.

My game skips much worse on medium settings than when set above the recommended settings...with the patched cvar disabled, of course.

Another fun fact for people getting all worked up saying my system specs are a combined issue for the game: two people on these boards have already reported similar setups with really great performance, so that assumption doesn't make sense. It also doesn't make sense to say it's viruses or spyware or a non-optimized system that's the culprit--My machine is damn near empty and I haven't downloaded anything in months and months. My machine is actually the recommended specs for the game, if you look on the box...and yet it was ****ed up.

Here's another fun fact: though I managed to get my HL2 to run tolerably well enough to finish and enjoy the game, HL2DM still has to be set on absurdly low settings to function tolerably. And while we're on the subject, HL2DM is a thrown-together brainless DM game and I'm glad no one is running around praising that for it's work ethic.

There is a big difference when someone with a voodoo2 and 8 megs of ram goes, "wtf id, Doom doesn't work for me! You suck!!" and me going, "I have the recommended system specs, a clean system, and this is the first app--besides Steam, another Valve masterpiece--that has performed so terribly."

And for anyone who's discussed it with me, you'll know--I was never impressed with Valve's work. I thought the original HL was pretty cool but not this legendary game it was made out to be. ANd I've always had nothing but bad things to say about Valve as a company--illegitimate busines practices, etc.

As for criticizing their programming...well, let's look at this logically, shall we?

The game has a measily ass 16 megabyte sound cache. Once you get the rocket launcher in HL2, there is roughly 35-50% of the game left to go through. Now, at that point, you have all the weapons, but those sounds do not go into memory. I think that's pretty ****ing stupid, don't you? To have the game waste effort to go snag a sound that you will very obviously be making several THOUSAND times throughout the rest of the game? Once you shoot the weapon, the sound will remain in memory until a new level (not section) is loaded. Of course Valve didn't catch the bug, on their systems they probably have 15,000 rpm harddrives and probably have all the audio and textures in decompressed formats (meaning not trapped inside a bigger file).

I'm going to take Doom out of my signature art. Maybe then you guys will find a better argument then denying the widespread problems I've experienced and calling me a fanboy. I never said anything about Doom being the better game--but if you want to argue who's a better company, then I'll be glad to go to town about things.

 

[Navanax]

The big bad source engine...is just the HL1 engine with all the parts of it that had limits deleted. It's not some great thing they built from the ground up, it's not some stripped-down-and-rebuilt god-like engine. It's just the same engine with Havok Physics plugged into it. They probably had to work harder to implement the physics into their SDK than anything else (because object textures determine weight and sound). "Four years perfecting the Source engine." Well, **** to that--the DX9 water shimmer could only have been implemented in the last year, and the same goes for the physics, which can't be older than the company that licensed them. Those are the two main features and we already know the physics part is at least a year old.

.... you're full of it. No further comments necessary.

I've tried the '-console' and '-heapsize xxxx' commands, and I can say that the game loads up a whole lot faster now, so thanks for the tip, Soulicro. However, it seems the other loading times haven't changed.

 

[SaiyanPrideXIX]

How is that full of it? Boot up the game--the initial load screen says "Physics by Havok Physics, www.havok.com." The water is a DX9 shader, too--you can see that by just cranking down to DX8 and check it out for yourself.

 

[Phatslugga]

Well I just beat the game, so this will probably be a moot point, but I'll make it anyway.

I think a lot of people have this inside out, or bass-ackwards. Here's some facts:

The big bad source engine...is just the HL1 engine with all the parts of it that had limits deleted. It's not some great thing they built from the ground up, it's not some stripped-down-and-rebuilt god-like engine. It's just the same engine with Havok Physics plugged into it. They probably had to work harder to implement the physics into their SDK than anything else (because object textures determine weight and sound). "Four years perfecting the Source engine." Well, **** to that--the DX9 water shimmer could only have been implemented in the last year, and the same goes for the physics, which can't be older than the company that licensed them. Those are the two main features and we already know the physics part is at least a year old.

Whatever, doesn't really matter, it's still a great game regardless of how the engine was made, or who owns it. I could care less if they rubbed a god damn lamp and a genie popped out granting them this engine and physics, bottom line is, it makes the game awesome. All I care is whether the game I play is good or not, and this is one of the best.

There is a thread with a HALF A MILLION VIEWS and 500 PAGES OF REPLIES on the steam forums called "Audio Stuttering." Now correct me if I'm wrong but if the game works great for you and you don't have this problem I doubt if you'd go onto the steam forum and view that thread. So we can logically assume that the vast majority of the people there are probably looking for a solution. The thread is also full of people who's first and only post on Steam's forum is in that thread, just to see if they can find a final solution.

6,000 replies... Im sure that it seems like a lot, but there are WAY more than 6,000 HL2 fans. Not to mention that all 6,000 of those posts are not all different people, and some of them are probably people just trying to help others that may not have the problem as bad, or at all. You can't say that everyone that views has a problem too. I view all kinds of help threads in the ESF forum and in other forums, it doesn't mean that I have all of those problems. Sometimes I'll try to help if I can. Eithe way, you're in the minority, face it. Now, this doesn't mean that it's not a problem that shouldn't be fixed, but what it does mean, is that this is normal. Grasp that concept, there is always a minority of fans that won't have it their way, and the game may encounter some problems.

The sound skipping problem IS as bad as he makes it out to be. So you were a lucky one that didn't have it so bad. That's great but it doesn't mean it wasn't as bad for the rest of us.

It also doesn't mean that it IS that bad for the rest of you. I never said that it wasn't a problem at all, I only said that I didn't have it so bad,and most of the people that I know that own the game aren't experiencing problems either. However, you're automatically assuming that everyone has the worst possible scenario here. I stand by my original argument - Yes, the game is flawed, and there is a minority of people who are having problems with it, but that's completley NORMAL. Stop over-reacting about it, and deal with it like a normal human-being. It's just a fecking game for crying out loud, it's not worth making such a fuss over something so petty. Like Sonic said, you all act as if Valve intentionally left these bugs in to piss off their customers... How is that logical? You think they want to lose customers? You know I've always respected you Pride, but you're being hypocritical here. Complaining about crits on Doom 3, and then sinking down to the same level with Half-Life 2. You didn't like it? Ok, then say that, but there really is no need to start calling the development team retards, and idiots. Especially since they've created one of the best FPS's ever, for a second time. There is a minority that will disagree with me, but once it's called game of the year again, then it really won't matter.

 

[owa]

Phat said it right. 6,000 replies in a thread are ALOT, but then again, not really. It is VERY small when compared to the number of HL2 owners.

The engine is nice, I rather enjoy it. The modles are fantastic, and although the textures can sometimes seem half-assed, I don't mind, the gameplay is what matters, and the sense of immersion.

The proplems you expierence Pride are annyoing, I imagine, but just because you seem to suffer from EVERY known proplem, and you keep making it sound like the engine/graphics are terrible (even though they are pretty nice), doesn't mean the game is awful. You just happen to have an incompatible PC.

 

[-JLN-]

Phat said it right. 6,000 replies in a thread are ALOT, but then again, not really. It is VERY small when compared to the number of HL2 owners.

I'm going to stick up for Pride here. It really doesn't matter whether 6,000 is a large percentage of the people who own it, as you've both already said, 6,000 is a lot. While I doubt that every reply is by a different person, for a brand new game not to work properly for that many people isn't acceptable. Especially when they have the required hardware that's said on the back of the box. As I've said before, I don't hate Valve, the engine, or the game, and I've had no problem, I'd be in denial if I said that the game doesn't have it's fair share of problems.

Edit: Oh yeah, and to criticise Pride, could you stop ranting about how much you hate Valve and all they do, and instead chill out, and discuss the flaws like a mature human being? I can understand that you're angry, but as you can see, ranting like that just pisses everyone off, presenting reasonable and well backed up points might get a much better reception.

 

[Hitokiri]

In regards to the DM:

I've never really heard of a DM that wasn't completely brainless. I mean, that's why it's called 'deathmatch', all you do is spawn, blow a bunch of people up, and then get blown up, get back up, and do it some more. The ability to barricade and shield with the grav gun at least adds some flavor to it, but other than that, I dunno what you're expecting out of it.

I had a lot of fun once I finally figured out how to get the map cf_mechwars to friggin work (the maker of the map pack had crap instructions.) You can actually pilot giant mechs, straight out of mechwarrior (except they're all just armed with a tau cannon.) Still, pretty crazy for a simple DM map (although it has plenty of flaws, i.e the spawn points and bland environment.)

 

[SaiyanPrideXIX]

Well, I suppose there are many points here to consider. I think I should clarify a bit.

First on the deathmatch--I just meant that those maps and what have you are all lifted straight from sections of the single player campaign with nearly no changes.

Maybe I did overblow it...but you have to understand, guys. I was furious. This game should have ran like warm butter out of the box for me on medium settings, but what I got was a skippy aggravating mess. Then I KIND OF fixed it...then they put out a patch and it got TEN TIMES WORSE.

Somewhere along the line of endless config tweaks and such, I got it to run nicely. And like I just said in a PM, I had a really great experience after that point where the skipping was minimal at best and I got to actually really get into the game more. At that point I was able to appreciate the game on a much more player/content level, as opposed to the sort of...troubleshooter/broke piece of equipment relationship I had with it prior.

As for all of these claims that my machine is at fault, I can assure you (though I'm sure it's been said a million times by much less honest folks) that my machine is in some of the best condition it's ever been in thanks to my new hard drive. I booted up Doom 3 the other day just to compare and even tweaked I'm still getting more visual and technical bang for my buck in Doom but that doesn't mean by any stretch of the imagination that HL2 is a bad or lacking game. I just don't understand how fairly standard issue setups like mine are suffering such wildly different results.

As for Valve's technical guru status...may I remind everyone that the game was delayed an extra year so they could completely redesign how the game interacted with Nvidia DX9 cards. Why? Because they got caught fabricating and "enhancing" benchmarks...they even had a problem in a benchmark that was discovered to be due to the game switching to Nvidia-friendly settings while taking screen shots. Then they go back on their distribution deal with Sierra/Vivendi and go to court...then they do all this unprofessional bull**** while we're all busy waiting for the game.

I dislike Valve, I always have, and that is because I was never impressed with them. Half Life 1 didn't impress me all that much. I thought it was great, don't get me wrong--but I wasn't in a stunned sort of awe. In fact the game compelled me so little that I don't think I ever finished the last parts. It is true that I like Id a lot, but that is because I am just proud to be in service under a guy like John Carmack.

Half Life 2 is built off of a borrowed engine, and licensed technology. Yeah what they did with it was great...but it's not going to redefine the technology side of things. Maybe the GAMEPLAY side of things, that's almost definite. But Carmack's technology has been breakthrough every time and I respect that--raising the bar is one thing, but Carmack has changed the entire way we do that stuff. So regarding my Doom vs. HL stuff, I'm pretty sure that we all agree--HL is the better gameplay choice and Doom is the better technical piece.

Now...that being said...there is a big difference between people going "omg that flashlight is so ***" and "Wow, I have the recommended specs on an otherwise well-running computer and this game runs worse than any game I've installed on this machine before."

 

[Sonic the Vampire]

Why are you so positive it's just the quake engine remodeled again somehow? You can run and jump and shoot in Deus Ex too. Maybe they stole the Unreal engine? It's their own engine regardless, and it's totally functional. It has at least 1 big flaw that effects more people than it should, but as soon as they get their act together and fix it 95% of the *****ing will die and people will start criticizing the game for its pros and cons rather than its technical issues.

And yes, havok did supply the physics, but I'm willing to bet valve had a large part in making them functional in gameplay, properly applying mass and bouyancy and having them cause damage to the player and non players as well as other objects. They were also responsible for designing the game around the physics rather than simply dropping physics on top of a finished game like Doom 3 or Half Life Source.

The VAST majority of games just borrow a pre-existing engine and tweak it to their liking. Valve at least created their own, even if it has similarities to their old Quake engine tweak, and it works. As soon as they fix the audio stuttering it'll be fine, until then just sit on the game. It's a shame it isn't really playable for you but I'm sure it wont always be that way.

Edit- I just noticed how you ended your last post and I must say if it is directed at Half life 2 it is completely retarded. Damn near EVERYONE who hasn't had the stuttering bug has said the game runs even more smoothly than they ever predicted it would, even when they are below the minimum specifications, so the argument is null.

 

[Kurt`]

Well, as hardware and computer specs evolve and are upgraded, more features are added to the respective rendering APIs (DirectX and OpenGL).

That's why people can take open source engines, like Quake 1, and add anti-aliasing support, multitextures, shaders, external physics packages (*cough* havok), etc.

The core of the apps are similar, what they set for internal limits, and what they limit their mappers and modelers to making is what controls your quality/visual appeal.

Saying that HL2 is an upgraded HL1 isn't really accurate. Sure, they may share some of the same base Win32 code, but the rendering APIs have been MUCH upgraded since then.

 

[Chrono5788]

Not to mention that even if some of the rendering code is similar to HL1's, it's still built by Valve, seeing as how id never made a Direct3D renderer...

They used an upgraded BSP, yes, and they reused a little game code, too... But they liscenced it, so if they want to use a little of what they spent probably over $10,000 to aquire again, rather than just retyping out something that has an identical final result, I say why not?

 

[owa]

Now...that being said...there is a big difference between people going "omg that flashlight is so ***" and "Wow, I have the recommended specs on an otherwise well-running computer and this game runs worse than any game I've installed on this machine before."

The flashlight is *** on EVERY machine, the system proplems are only *** on a small number of machines.

You keep useing the engine as an arguement, how it is only simple, and not groundbreaking. Who cares? It has awsome physics, and looks shiny and pretty (I love the water). Who really cares how un-altered it is, or how they didn't build it from scratch? As long as it does the job for the majority, who cares?

You forget that besides the nice graphics, Doom 3 did very little groundbreaking wise. Not to mention that better graphics engines are coming. Graphics don't make something groundbreaking. The gameplay does.

 

[SaiyanPrideXIX]

Graphics don't make something groundbreaking. The gameplay does.

I agree. But technology breaks ground the same way gameplay does. Both of these engines have features that will become the standards in gaming. There will be days ahead where a game without reflective water or physics, or a game without full environment bump mapping and full light and shadow engines, will be considered primitive and ****-tastic. No doubt.

BUT...if designers like John Carmack thought like that, none of us would be using polygons or 3D or physics or any of that stuff. Not to mention, if gameplay is what's important then you owe more to the Doom guys than you think. They did after all pretty much bring about the birth of 3D gaming, Deathmatch, the First Person Shooter, and the very concept of Multiplayer gaming over the internet. To me those contributions amount to a little more than two games in 6 years, a borrowed physics engine (which I can license and plug into Doom's engine with more than likely better results), and pretty water.

You want to talk about groundbreaking? Jumping puzzles...vehicles...even the physics...none of that is groundbreaking. We've seen all of that before. In a couple of spots, the way the physics were implemented into the gameplay was awesome, and THAT is a first and credit is due. But it's not a huge technological achievement; merely the next step in a logical process.

I have said a million times that the game (HL2) is plenty good. My argument isn't that Half Life is a bad game or that Doom is a better one--it's that, plain and simple, Valve Software are not the benevolent gods of gaming that they are made out to be.

Physics physics physics...what are you guys going to do if a Doom 3 expansion pack comes out that has wide open spaces and strong combat-based play with a physics engine implemented?

I guess you can all still ***** about the flashlight...

Oh, and @Sonic: Honestly, I'm not that impressed with the buoyancy or weights of the objects. There are only three weight/buoyancy types in the game: wood, metal, and bouncy. Barrels behave the same way as filing cabinets; huge boxes and small boxes behave the same regardless of contents; and when the stuff is flying out of the gravity gun, it all is pretty much the same velocity anyway, as far as I can tell.

 

[owa]

I agree. But technology breaks ground the same way gameplay does. Both of these engines have features that will become the standards in gaming. There will be days ahead where a game without reflective water or physics, or a game without full environment bump mapping and full light and shadow engines, will be considered primitive and ****-tastic. No doubt.

BUT...if designers like John Carmack thought like that, none of us would be using polygons or 3D or physics or any of that stuff. Not to mention, if gameplay is what's important then you owe more to the Doom guys than you think. They did after all pretty much bring about the birth of 3D gaming, Deathmatch, the First Person Shooter, and the very concept of Multiplayer gaming over the internet. To me those contributions amount to a little more than two games in 6 years, a borrowed physics engine (which I can license and plug into Doom's engine with more than likely better results), and pretty water.

You want to talk about groundbreaking? Jumping puzzles...vehicles...even the physics...none of that is groundbreaking. We've seen all of that before. In a couple of spots, the way the physics were implemented into the gameplay was awesome, and THAT is a first and credit is due. But it's not a huge technological achievement; merely the next step in a logical process.

I have said a million times that the game (HL2) is plenty good. My argument isn't that Half Life is a bad game or that Doom is a better one--it's that, plain and simple, Valve Software are not the benevolent gods of gaming that they are made out to be.

Physics physics physics...what are you guys going to do if a Doom 3 expansion pack comes out that has wide open spaces and strong combat-based play with a physics engine implemented?

I guess you can all still ***** about the flashlight...

Oh, and @Sonic: Honestly, I'm not that impressed with the buoyancy or weights of the objects. There are only three weight/buoyancy types in the game: wood, metal, and bouncy. Barrels behave the same way as filing cabinets; huge boxes and small boxes behave the same regardless of contents; and when the stuff is flying out of the gravity gun, it all is pretty much the same velocity anyway, as far as I can tell.

I agree. But technology breaks ground the same way gameplay does. Both of these engines have features that will become the standards in gaming. There will be days ahead where a game without reflective water or physics, or a game without full environment bump mapping and full light and shadow engines, will be considered primitive and ****-tastic. No doubt.

This is just evolution of graphics, it is just the way things work. Everyone strives to look nice, but looking nice doesn't mean the game will be nice. Graphics are what present the game. Great graphics with awful gameplay will not do good.

Average graphics with great gameplay will do alot.

Terrible graphics with amazing gameplay will not do well either, as the presentation of the gameplay is done poorly. See what I mean?

Now if a game has AMAZING graphics (IE: Doom3), but with poor gameplay aspects, or just average, it'll score points with some, but for those looking for something more, somethign original, something compelling, they will not be thrilled, and lets just say, most of us fall in the latter category.

BUT...if designers like John Carmack thought like that, none of us would be using polygons or 3D or physics or any of that stuff. Not to mention, if gameplay is what's important then you owe more to the Doom guys than you think. They did after all pretty much bring about the birth of 3D gaming, Deathmatch, the First Person Shooter, and the very concept of Multiplayer gaming over the internet. To me those contributions amount to a little more than two games in 6 years, a borrowed physics engine (which I can license and plug into Doom's engine with more than likely better results), and pretty water.

If Carmack hadn't of done it, someone else would have. We owe the OLD doom 1 game something, it started the evolution, but we owe Doom 3 nothing, besides it having good graphics.

2 games in 6 years, but with a huge following, great reviews, and the likely game of the year winner mean something. If the games were as bad as you make them sound, then they'd be getting 65% ratings from PCGamer, or 6/10 from other places. Not what they are getting. It must be pretty revolutionary, otherwise people wouldn't like it.

You want to talk about groundbreaking? Jumping puzzles...vehicles...even the physics...none of that is groundbreaking. We've seen all of that before. In a couple of spots, the way the physics were implemented into the gameplay was awesome, and THAT is a first and credit is due. But it's not a huge technological achievement; merely the next step in a logical process.

Next step in a logical process? Then we must owe Doom1 nothing then, as it must have just been a logical step in gaming.
:S

Physics physics physics...what are you guys going to do if a Doom 3 expansion pack comes out that has wide open spaces and strong combat-based play with a physics engine implemented?

If Doom3 does this, then I guess I'll have found a new pass-time. I'm not a fanboy, if Doom3 does this, then jesus christ, it'll be sweet. will they do it? No.