More blows to global warming

[DiebytheSword]

http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080314/COMMENTARY/702895001/home.html

These problems led Mr. Wegman's team to conclude that the idea that the planet is experiencing unprecedented global warming "cannot be supported."



The IPCC published its Fourth Assessment Report in 2007 predicting global warming will lead to widespread catastrophe if not mitigated, yet failed to provide the most basic requirement for effective climate policy: accurate temperature statistics. A number of weaknesses in the measurements include the fact temperatures aren't recorded from large areas of the Earth's surface and many weather stations once in undeveloped areas are now surrounded by buildings, parking lots and other heat-trapping structures resulting in an urban-heat-island effect.

And here is another snippet from NOAA:

The average temperature across both the contiguous U.S. and the globe during climatological winter (December 2007-February 2008) was the coolest since 2001, according to scientists at NOAA’s National Climatic Data Center in Asheville, N.C. In terms of winter precipitation, Pacific storms, bringing heavy precipitation to large parts of the West, produced high snowpack that will provide welcome runoff this spring.

A complete analysis is available online.

http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2008/20080313_coolest.html

Something in the numbers is now not adding up, calling attention on yourself with big headlines is cause for closer scruitiny.

 

[Synth]

It's quite obvious that 'global warming' is and will always be, a political tool.

Our planet's behavior is way more related to our positioning in the solar system, than anything else.

 

[Optimus Prime]

It's quite obvious that 'global warming' is and will always be, a political tool.

Our planet's behavior is way more related to our positioning in the solar system, than anything else.

Says the guy who claims Kurt hacked his TV across the interbutts.

Anyways.

Global warming is occurring.

No ifs ands or buts about it.

The debate is. Are we somehow making it worse/speeding it up?

 

[Sicron]

Anyone still saying Global Warming isn't happening is, I am sorry to say this, but an ignorant idiot. Here in Holland we used to have snow every year, now I haven't seen it in years.

Temperatures were always around minus 20, last year, the lowest temperature was probably minus...2.

Ducks and the like have already begun breeding in the winter, plants are already growing months before they actually should and birds aren't even leaving our country for warmer climates. Bugs, wasps and mosquitos particulairy, don't get killed by the freezing weather, so we will probably have a wasp and mosquito plague...again.

This is not supposed to happen. And all the things above happend in Holland. But Global warming is also happening in the USA...Katrina anyone?

But it doesn't matter if the global temperature doesn't increase that much, problem is that the polar temperature is increasing. Which basicly means that he poles are melting, cold blocks of ice fall into the sea, cooling down the sea. Which is a big problem, as soon as the Gulfstream starts to cool down, the entire world will cool down, starting a new ice age.

It's quite obvious that 'global warming' is and will always be, a political tool.

Our planet's behavior is way more related to our positioning in the solar system, than anything else.

Earth is in a very vunerable place in space. Just because our position isn't changing, doesn't mean the sun doesn't affect us. If we get closer to the sun, we'd burn. Further away and we'd freeze. The only way we are around this temperature, is because this is the sweet spot for our atmosphere. Anything affecting our atmosphere, and temperatures will change. The only thing that stands between us and the extreme temperature and radiation from the sun is our only barrier, the atmosphere. Destroying it and we will burn, and in the end, cool us down. Kind of oxymoronic, isn't it?

 

[Synth]

When people refer to 'global warming' they refer that it's something 'we're' causing.

I don't think that's the case.

It's likely just a stage in the planet's orbit.

 

[Pieter Paul Rubens]

Indeed, global warming is a perfectly natural thing and has happend before. In (x)xxx years we'll have an ice age to reset everything back to how it should be.

So yes, all we can ask ourselves now is: are we speeding this thing up or not? But as Kurt Cobain once said: "It's better to burn out than to fade away".. So basically, it's happening anyway, so might as well rush towards it and get it over with. If this means that a lot of humans won't survive, so be it.
I'm a firm believer that human society has turned into a cesspit of idiocy and blatant arrogance so I don't mind seeing mankind's impending doom.. Then again, this won't happen when I'm alive, so I couldn't care even less.

What I do care about, however, is that the climate in Belgium & Co. is turning into the climate those mediterranean countries have.. I don't like warmth, high temperatures are ftl.. Give me rain and semi-cold and I'm a happy person.. Give me warmth and sun, and I'm pissed off for not being able to cool down.

 

[Dzamija]

When people refer to 'global warming' they refer that it's something 'we're' causing.

I don't think that's the case.

It's likely just a stage in the planet's orbit.

It's called the greenhouse effect.

Now I'm sure you've all been in a greenhouse. Note how hot it is in there all the time, and kinda heavy to breathe. The gases, such as C02, create that same effect across the entire planet. We're used to it on that scale and we don't even notice it.

The Earth's average surface temperature is around 33 °C, while without the greenhouse effect, it would be 15 °C and we'd all most likely die.

Now, we make it worse by intensifying that same greenhouse effect, with emmisions of C02, methane, and other less significant gases. That, along with the destruction of the Ozone, is where we're 'speeding up' global warming, if you put that way.

 

[Avenger]

http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/research/2008/feb/global.html#temp

Take a long good look at that before you state "global warming is bull****".

Methane is not an "insignificant" gas. It is the biggest worry of climate scientists at the moment.

 

[Synth]

Not to go Jinx on this thread, but it's almost as if we're claiming responsibility for global warming, so we can act like we can fix it.

So, the masses won't panic, and have anarchy ensue.

I'm not going to be sitting on my ass, hanging on every word Al Gore says, while a huge tidal wave takes out the east coast.

Sorry.

 

[DaRkOwNs]

in this particular issue i want us to take responsibility for global warming so we can stop destroying ****.

nothing less than the fall of man will stop that.

 

[Chakra-X]

I don't think global warming is 100% "because humans are ignorant of their surroundings", but I definitely think we could be wasting/emitting less (or to say, we are better off now than 30 years ago).

We can not halt the planet's temperature for eternity and it takes more than short term observations to make a long term climate prediction.

 

[Avenger]

What the hell is up with the negative use of the term anarchy? Might be that we have two words for that term in my language, but the political system is not something to be looked down upon if executed properly in the right society at the right time (likely, in a few hundred years, we'll all be following some form of anarchy).

On topic:

We are not responsible for Global Warming. We are however, responsible for accelerating this natural process. This is a fact, not an opinion. The only thing questioned among scientists is to what degree we are in fact accelerating it. Whether you know that 27% of all CO2 in the atmosphere is released by us or not might be relevant in realising howwe have affected the environment. The amount of change we have been seeing the past two hundred years cannot be explained by anything other than human interaction with the environment.

What I think, is that the US, and a lot of other countries in the world, do not want to admit that we do affect the environment - mainly because this will have severe economical drawbacks, along with many practical drawbacks. I mean, how many Americans aren't driving SUVs for no reason?

I have not once seen a rational explanation for how humans do not accelerate global warming, and until I do, I think threads like these are pointless.

 

[Synth]

I could replace 'anarchy' with 'pandemic' if you want.

And the whole 'acceleration' deal also seems like a band-aid as well.

The worse we can do is contaminate the air and soil/ground water with minoxide and poisons.

 

[sub]

We're cutting down forests at an alarming rate while at the same time pumping more and more Co2 into the atmosphere. I don't think that's a wise combination

 

[J-Dude]

"Urban-heat-island effect"

...

Hahahahahaha!!!

I seem to recall posting about that SAME theory, and then having someone here say "that's totally unfounded!"

So what, was it just because it was me that you guys didn't believe me, or what? Because...I hate to say it but...WHO CALLED IT FIRST, BEECHES?!

HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Okay, but seriously though...

I'm really glad that this is coming out into the open now. This forum's attitude towards this has shifted drastically in the last few years.

 

[Arthos]

I still think it's just natural climate change. Technically we're still thawing out from the recent ice ages. One short one within recorded history, and millions of years prior.

What are we supposed to do if it IS just a climate change? If the planet wants to warm up, it's gonna warm up and there ain't a damn thing we can do to stop it. No Carbon credits, no lowering of emissions, no crazy hollywood sci-fi flick plot. Nothing.


I'm not saying give up. If it IS our fault, then by all means do everything you can to fix it. This little blue spec is all we've got.

I'm just saying that sometimes there are forces out of our finite control. We are totally at the mercy of nature. And sometimes Mother Nature is... for lack of a more appropriate usage of words, a Harsh, cruel female canine in heat.

 

[hellrider]

we need to unleash the dark cloud in order to block the sun light. that's the only way we can cooling the planet temperature.

 

[Synth]

OMG HELLRIDER, I AM TOTALLY GONNA BAIT MYSELF FOR A WARNING, RIGHT NOW! NOOOOO!

Anyways, I think the film "Day After Tommorow" basically sums up what will likely happen.

 

[Arthos]

OMG HELLRIDER, I AM TOTALLY GONNA BAIT MYSELF FOR A WARNING, RIGHT NOW! NOOOOO!

Anyways, I think the film "Day After Tommorow" basically sums up what will likely happen.

Which one?

 

[Avenger]

@Arthos, would you say releasing a quantity of CO2 that today equals to 27% of that of the entire world is "normal" and "harmless"?

Sub is right, deforestation also plays a key part in all of this. Less trees means less CO2 gets turned into oxygen.

I don't understand why Cuc gave us a source that effectively works against his claims (what with the polar ice melting, ocean temperatures rising and global temperatures rising) though, nor do I understand how he could write "more blows to global warming" when global warming is no longer a theory, but a fact that a lot of sceptics just gave up on a while ago. There is nothing that says a bit of heat could not trigger cold in certain areas. We have no idea how accelerated heating could affect certain areas.

What I do know is that Norway and most European countries have been experiencing rising temperatures since 1960 (there's documentation of this, plus I know several people much older than you, Cuc, who also concur with this claim) and earlier (only this data might not be as reliable as the NOAA's I suppose).

While you say it's been colder, there have also been heat anomalies in the south east. My guess is that global warming is causing unstable weather conditions in the US at an increasing rate (hurricanes, anyone?).