Two suggestions from the Orkut community.
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Cunning as Zeus
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Might be a little off topic, but I think the problem dividing the team and the "pro" playerbase are tons and tons of misconceptions.
Most pros think the team is full of tyrannical mother****ers who are out to screw up ESF. A lot of them believe the team isn't willing to entertain the notion that perhaps they should listen to the people who have mastered the game, and take some of their crits and suggestions to heart.
Meanwhile, the team thinks pros don't want to fix the game. They just want to have the game "their way". They believe pros aren't willing to negotiate, and are mostly pompous asses (that's what I've gathered, anyway).
So, a suggestion for the forum and team is to set up a PR campaign. Most people probably won't think this is worth the effort, but it's time to repair the rift that has divided us between "Us" and "Them". A lot of the people playing ESF are full of great ideas, but they have a tendency to say it once, and then forget about it because "it's never going to happen" due to the crazy demon team members.
I don't know how you'd go about doing this, but I think it'd be worth a try. Kinda sucks to have someone like Kai say "THE TEAM MEMBERS ARE EVIL MOTHER****ERS WTF?!!?!1!!1" all the time to his clan members, spreading the hate. A little PR can change all of that, and could potentially benefit the community in a big way in the long run.
Most pros think the team is full of tyrannical mother****ers who are out to screw up ESF. A lot of them believe the team isn't willing to entertain the notion that perhaps they should listen to the people who have mastered the game, and take some of their crits and suggestions to heart.
Meanwhile, the team thinks pros don't want to fix the game. They just want to have the game "their way". They believe pros aren't willing to negotiate, and are mostly pompous asses (that's what I've gathered, anyway).
So, a suggestion for the forum and team is to set up a PR campaign. Most people probably won't think this is worth the effort, but it's time to repair the rift that has divided us between "Us" and "Them". A lot of the people playing ESF are full of great ideas, but they have a tendency to say it once, and then forget about it because "it's never going to happen" due to the crazy demon team members.
I don't know how you'd go about doing this, but I think it'd be worth a try. Kinda sucks to have someone like Kai say "THE TEAM MEMBERS ARE EVIL MOTHER****ERS WTF?!!?!1!!1" all the time to his clan members, spreading the hate. A little PR can change all of that, and could potentially benefit the community in a big way in the long run.
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You really hit the nail on the head.
I dont think there's a mod that has a larger rift between its creator's and its playerbase.
The players I know dont come here because they dont like the community, they feel its more of a "forum community" than an Esf community.
I started posting here mostly because I wanted to voice my opinion about 1.3, and I wasnt exactly postive about it, and earned (and in some cases deserved) my fair share of slobbering fanboy flames.
Pro's will be pros, they didnt get good because they have a magical ability to play Esf 1.2, it was because they liked the game, and played regularly.
Change doesnt bother me, but change for the worse does.
There's a difference between a new Idea..and a bunch of restrictions placed on the older Idea that one everyone loved, just so people are forced to use this new Idea that everyone hated in the last version..
The Tenkaitchi 2/Sparking Neo comparisons aren't even funny anymore...because the reality is thats the way the game is headed.
I dont think there's a mod that has a larger rift between its creator's and its playerbase.
The players I know dont come here because they dont like the community, they feel its more of a "forum community" than an Esf community.
I started posting here mostly because I wanted to voice my opinion about 1.3, and I wasnt exactly postive about it, and earned (and in some cases deserved) my fair share of slobbering fanboy flames.
Pro's will be pros, they didnt get good because they have a magical ability to play Esf 1.2, it was because they liked the game, and played regularly.
Change doesnt bother me, but change for the worse does.
There's a difference between a new Idea..and a bunch of restrictions placed on the older Idea that one everyone loved, just so people are forced to use this new Idea that everyone hated in the last version..
The Tenkaitchi 2/Sparking Neo comparisons aren't even funny anymore...because the reality is thats the way the game is headed.
Cunning as Zeus
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I agree with Dewd. I understand wanting to change the game. I really do. Hell, I quit every now and again so that I can start fresh. But to change the game JUST for the sake of changing it is wrong. Don't put me in a stray tie my hands behind my back, break my legs, and tell me 1.3 is a new and exciting experience. It just isn't. It feels like a prettier, broken version of 1.2.
Notice how the intent was to keep pros from being pros. It's that kind of thing that causes a rift in the community.
Notice how the intent was to keep pros from being pros. It's that kind of thing that causes a rift in the community.
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maybe, You won't read this post as a post of someone who is aways in this forum, but as the most of you I'm a pro Player,I play since de 1.1 and actually in the same clan o Volrath, and I'm concerned to the way Esf 1.3 is heading too
as 1.2 I think Esf 1.3 is a controversial game, In the beginning it can really be exciting "woooow kamehameha nice!" but as you keep playing the game, if you like it you'll try hard and be a pro player otherwhise you will hate it... the G point of this is the MELEE, a lot of people quit because of the melee, which is in the beginning a little complicated.
This game will never atract a lot of players because of the melee, you can make 10, 20 versions but it will never change, only if you take off the melee of the system, which is a ridiculous thing to do. I think the team, should worry less about the new people and get concerned about the old fellows! Trying to get Esf more important and professional.
An example was the extint world championship of Esf that was about to happen this Year... the [SoE] clan (that I'm a member which is from Brazil) was going to participate, but then the team quit the idea and start doing the 1.3!
I think that If the team don't wanna do the 1.3, they should quit the project and start trying to get the mod ESF to a pro level, but if they wanna do, they should really work on it.
As someone said before, We don't care if the system will change, if it's for good, because a pro isn't a pro because has a gift, is because he/she worked hard to get in this level, but if it's for bad we should warn the team and try to make changes.
as 1.2 I think Esf 1.3 is a controversial game, In the beginning it can really be exciting "woooow kamehameha nice!" but as you keep playing the game, if you like it you'll try hard and be a pro player otherwhise you will hate it... the G point of this is the MELEE, a lot of people quit because of the melee, which is in the beginning a little complicated.
This game will never atract a lot of players because of the melee, you can make 10, 20 versions but it will never change, only if you take off the melee of the system, which is a ridiculous thing to do. I think the team, should worry less about the new people and get concerned about the old fellows! Trying to get Esf more important and professional.
An example was the extint world championship of Esf that was about to happen this Year... the [SoE] clan (that I'm a member which is from Brazil) was going to participate, but then the team quit the idea and start doing the 1.3!
I think that If the team don't wanna do the 1.3, they should quit the project and start trying to get the mod ESF to a pro level, but if they wanna do, they should really work on it.
As someone said before, We don't care if the system will change, if it's for good, because a pro isn't a pro because has a gift, is because he/she worked hard to get in this level, but if it's for bad we should warn the team and try to make changes.
Im not sure what you're trying to say, but we didn't make any kind of world championship... wasn't our idea. We are also continuing to work on 1.3 all the time we can, its just the work may be heading in the wrong direction.
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I think thats up to us.
Keep in mind that you have absolutely no right at all to demand things. We create it, you take it or not.
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as you should know, what the client wants is not aways the same what the user needs, I was giving a user point of view, not a client point of view.
as Agamemnon said you should ask about what to do in the new version of esf to the people who play esf, not the people who posts in this forum.
thats why I complained
I would accept it without complains if you could accept some suggestions of the Esf players instead of only fixing the bugs.
but you'll probally don't care about this, as you( the team) didn't even care about the suggestions that was written in the begginig of this forum =/
I think we're seeing the elements of what Agamemnon mentioned here: http://forum.esforces.com/showpost.php?p=840194&postcount=22
Please dont consider the team to be full of people that dont listen, the fact is, if you're looking for team members more in touch with the playerbase I think DJ would be one of the best candidates, what you were saying above really was offensive to any team members, saying "well you should just quit cuz you're not doing what we want" when you've spent as long as we have on some things, that kinda attitude is really offensive. DJ and I aren't the ones who decide what happens, believe or not, the team makes every decision through democratic vote. Any team member, in any meeting is able to bring up any topic they want, be it a suggestion from here to competition ideas. The only problem is, that a lot of the team are completely out of touch with the players. It doesnt help with rifts in threads like these, because you cant then bring up points in a meeting and have the validity of those points assured, they can be dismissed easily, just because of the conduct associated with certain people, or the conduct within a thread.
Some PR work could help, but i can only speculate how effective it would be.
Please dont consider the team to be full of people that dont listen, the fact is, if you're looking for team members more in touch with the playerbase I think DJ would be one of the best candidates, what you were saying above really was offensive to any team members, saying "well you should just quit cuz you're not doing what we want" when you've spent as long as we have on some things, that kinda attitude is really offensive. DJ and I aren't the ones who decide what happens, believe or not, the team makes every decision through democratic vote. Any team member, in any meeting is able to bring up any topic they want, be it a suggestion from here to competition ideas. The only problem is, that a lot of the team are completely out of touch with the players. It doesnt help with rifts in threads like these, because you cant then bring up points in a meeting and have the validity of those points assured, they can be dismissed easily, just because of the conduct associated with certain people, or the conduct within a thread.
Some PR work could help, but i can only speculate how effective it would be.
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Ok, sorry for the offensive way that I wrote, I didn't intend to offend anybody, but guys, unfortunately this is the truth , the esf is not heading to a good way, and dud, I already made systems of months that when I delivered it to the client, he said "I didn't like it, I won't pay for it" and people who works in this area knows that these thinks happens. (just quoting your post "when you've spent as long as we have on some things, that kinda attitude is really offensive")
As I said in the beginning of this post, I didn't intend to hurt anyone fellings, I just tried to say the truth (at least for some people, not an absolute truth (lol philosophy now
))
As I said in the beginning of this post, I didn't intend to hurt anyone fellings, I just tried to say the truth (at least for some people, not an absolute truth (lol philosophy now
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You do understand a World Championship would be completely pointless, considering everyone lives..all over the world, and there's a little thing called latency to consider.
As for whatever else you said, I didnt read much, so..whatever.
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at least our clan were about to travel to London (where would happen the world championship)
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Yea, but the esf team doesn't have anything with that... It was just a big lan house, with a big idea of gathering nice players and call it the first 'lan world championship'. But he left the forums and never talked to us again, only hope was left.
I'm saying that will not happen now cos we are on 2007 already.