Transparent frogs help researchers without disection.

[Brosiris]

TOKYO (AFP) - Japanese researchers have succeeded in producing see-through frogs, letting them observe organs, blood vessels and eggs under the skin without performing dissections.

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"You can see through the skin how organs grow, how cancer starts and develops," said the lead researcher Masayuki Sumida, professor at the Institute for Amphibian Biology of state-run Hiroshima University.

"You can watch organs of the same frog over its entire life as you don't have to dissect it. The researcher can also observe how toxins affect bones, livers and other organs at lower costs," he told AFP.

Dissections have become increasingly controversial in much of the world, particularly in schools where animal rights activists have pressed for humane alternatives such as using computer simulations.

Sumida said his team, which announced the research last week at an academic conference, had created the first transparent four-legged creature, although some small fish are also see-through.

The researchers produced the creature from rare mutants of the Japanese brown frog, or Rena japonica, whose backs are usually ochre or brown.

Two kinds of recessive genes have been known to cause the frog to be pale.

Sumida's team crossed two frogs with recessive genes through artificial insemination and the offspring looked normal due to the presence of more powerful genes. But crossing the offspring led to a frog whose skin is transparent from the tadpole stage.

"You can see dramatic changes of organs when tadpoles mutate into frogs," said Sumida, whose team is seeking a patent.

Such frogs could theoretically exist in the wild but it is "virtually impossible" they would naturally inherit so many recessive genes, Sumida said.

The transparent frogs can also reproduce, with their offspring inheriting their parents' traits, but their grandchildren die shortly after birth.

"As they have two sets of recessive genes, something wrong must kick in and kill them," Sumida said.

While the researchers relied on artificial insemination, they said that genetic engineering could also produce transparent and even illuminating frogs.

Sumida said researchers could also inject into the transparent frogs an illuminating protein attached to a gene, which would light up the gene once it manifests -- for example, showing at what stage cancer starts.

Sumida said it would be unrealistic to apply the same method to mammals such as mice as their skin structure is different.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070927/od_afp/sciencejapanbiologyanimal_070927185409

Found this rather interesting. Any thoughts ideas? Do you like it? Or do you think we're playing God?

Personally if this helps us take one step closer to curing cancer then I say so be it, I support it.

 

[sub]

The playing God argument is retarded. Humans are animals, and as animals, anything we do is natural. If we, through evolution, have advanced to a point where we can do such things for our benefit, why not?

 

[Almighty_Gir]

**** cancer, i just want a glowing frog o/

 

[vinay87]

Maybe in the near future they can try this on humans so they start glowing and in an instant their hair turns yellow and they start getting bad hair-dos

 

[J-Dude]

Transparent frog?

Okay, I get it, but that can really only cover the immediate anatomy.

As to playing God, I hate genetic engineering. It's just something we shouldn't be ****ing with. You hate computer viruses? Just wait till hackers become genetic coders who design REAL viruses that can take down an entire ****ing continent. Man-made monstrosities, man-made plagues...Yeah, the benefits could be huge, but the dire consequences will be correspondingly huge as well, and will be well deserved if we keep messing with things we have NO business meddling with.

I personally have no idea if animals have souls as humans do, but if they do, then what we're doing to them by ****ing with their genetic structure is nothing short of evil. Creatures that are manufactured instead of truly born, bred for a purpose deemed by humans. I think it's already cruel enough what we do to animals bred for slaughter without wronging them by tampering with their DNA. I'm no vegetarian, but I still don't advocate animal cruelty.

 

[Eon]

Well it's the samet hing as most religions, man was created to worship and serve their creator..and if not they get eternal punishment, so meh, I think we're a bit nicer.

 

[J-Dude]

Well it's the samet hing as most religions, man was created to worship and serve their creator..and if not they get eternal punishment, so meh, I think we're a bit nicer.

Difference: We are mortal, and don't know what the **** we're doing. Our "creations" will end up destroying us. God, KNOWS wtf he's doing, and has the power and authority to handle such things. Face it: we are stupid, inquisitive creatures who will bring about complete ruin if we interfere in things above our place to meddle in. We don't have the right, or the sense to wield such power. We're like dumbass kids who came across their Dad's gun.

 

[Dokutayuu]

Transparent frog?

Okay, I get it, but that can really only cover the immediate anatomy.

As to playing God, I hate genetic engineering. It's just something we shouldn't be ****ing with. You hate computer viruses? Just wait till hackers become genetic coders who design REAL viruses that can take down an entire ****ing continent. Man-made monstrosities, man-made plagues...Yeah, the benefits could be huge, but the dire consequences will be correspondingly huge as well, and will be well deserved if we keep messing with things we have NO business meddling with.

I personally have no idea if animals have souls as humans do, but if they do, then what we're doing to them by ****ing with their genetic structure is nothing short of evil. Creatures that are manufactured instead of truly born, bred for a purpose deemed by humans. I think it's already cruel enough what we do to animals bred for slaughter without wronging them by tampering with their DNA. I'm no vegetarian, but I still don't advocate animal cruelty.

Impossible Creatures?

Interesting but I think we should stick with plants. We don't really need to mess with animals. How we evolved to be able to do this stuff, God would have given us a sign if it was completely wrong (which I'm not saying it isn't)

 

[MC]

Face it: we are stupid, inquisitive creatures who will bring about complete ruin if we interfere in things above our place to meddle in.

We're far from stupid. The only reason why we embark on such research is because it's in our nature to. If we weren't curious, then we wouldn't be talking right now, in fact we probably would have died out a long time ago. Besides, if we weren't meant to "meddle" in genetics or anything of that nature, then God would most likely have done something to prevent it. Just because scientists are doing things that border what God can do, doesn't mean it's evil nor playing God. Besides, we aren't doing this stuff just to do it, we're doing it to help better ourselves.

We don't have the right, or the sense to wield such power. We're like dumbass kids who came across their Dad's gun.

That's where the question lies. Who's the "dumbass"? The kid who found the gun or the dad who left it where the kid can get it?

Don't take any offense to that last statement if you figure it out, I'm merely using your analogy.

 

[frsrblch]

When the Flying Spaghetti Monster created the universe (after drinking heavily), He set down His divine Eight "I'd Really Rather You Didn'ts". This loose moral code is the origin of all human morality, and nowhere does it mention that fumbling around with His creatures is wrong.

We eat the little buggers anyway, so what's it to Him if we decide to tinker with their genetics?

 

[Eon]

We're far from stupid. The only reason why we embark on such research is because it's in our nature to. If we weren't curious, then we wouldn't be talking right now, in fact we probably would have died out a long time ago. Besides, if we weren't meant to "meddle" in genetics or anything of that nature, then God would most likely have done something to prevent it. Just because scientists are doing things that border what God can do, doesn't mean it's evil nor playing God. Besides, we aren't doing this stuff just to do it, we're doing it to help better ourselves.


That's where the question lies. Who's the "dumbass"? The kid who found the gun or the dad who left it where the kid can get it?

Don't take any offense to that last statement if you figure it out, I'm merely using your analogy.

Heh, I like that last statement, that is true.





Honestly, curiosity is probably one of the greatest things ever, it's a big thing.

There's a huge different between sentient life, and insentient life. Things that just live for survival, their most complicated thoughts are:

"whoa..there's food over there"

"crap I better move or I might die"

"Crap...predator, time to run"

"mmm reproduction time"


now let's say we were in space and found another planet of sentient beings and started experimenting with them.

THAT would be really ****ed up, especially when doing that to something else that can reason, hold discussion, etc.

 

[J-Dude]

@MC: Fair enough, but which would make more sense to a being putting a mortal sentient creature through tests of morality and loyalty? Barring the ability completely, or offering the option as temptation for the faithful to deny? In short, why CAN we screw with DNA? So we can choose NOT to. It's all about being given the ability to choose, and then making the right decisions.

Look, I can understand medicine, but somewhere SOMEONE has got to get the nations together and draw a STRAIGHT...****ING...LINE, as to what practices are acceptable, and what practices will get you a life sentence for even joking about attempting. But as insane as it sounds, given enough time to master the genetic code, what's to stop people creating whole new species' of animals that are perfect killing machines? Who's to stop some jackass from engineering rats to produce nitorglycerin in their livers, and then setting them loose to breed with normal rat populations in major city sewers, ultimately ****ing over the whole populace with a little animal that can spontaneously go off like a grenade at any given moment?

Sound crazy? Hell yes, but damnit, tell me just how crazy it sounds in 30 years! Probably not nearly as impossible; maybe even everyday! "This just in, tragedy strikes the residents of a New York City apartment, as a nest of Nitro Rats was triggered into demolishing the entire residence upon being struck by a broom..."

I really hope I don't come off as a religious fanatic to you guys; I have strong opinions and a firm perception of right and wrong, but there are some ways in which I doubt God. For instance, if someone had the means to create an artificial creature...a sentient creature, like a robot, or more accurately an android, and that android was designed to be as human as possible, but learned how to love others on its' own...and you came to love it, or him or her like like your own brother/sister/what-have-you and it was selfless enough and good enough to ascend to heaven when it died (if it were human)...well, I've always wondered if God were strict and cold enough to deny giving that being a soul of its' own, or loving and understanding enough to love it like his own...

...I've given it a lot of thought, and I'd love to think the latter would be true...but honestly, if the former was true...I would reject God. Either reject him, or simply grant the creature my own soul to keep as its' own, and let me take it's place in nonexistence.

 

[Eon]

If views on religion were ever incorporated into one, nay multiple governments,such as things as small as genetic engineering, history will repeat itself as it always has, religious views incorporated into government and law leads to one thing: violence, it always has, and it always will, which is why something like this would be worseif there were international laws against it.

And I know you were exaggerating to make a point, but all that was changed was the hue of the flesh of a creature, in no way shape or form do I personally think anytime soon (christ, even 30 years is absurd) will people get to the point of genetically engineering creatures to where their organic structure could be used for devasation, or to contain non-organic components unless its prosthetic or cybernetic, and even then would have to be applied after the birth of something.

Genetics doesn't work that way, genetics can be altered, and even change naturally over time as with the evolution stages of animals adapting to climate and radical environment changes, but you cannot spontaneously put whatever the **** you want into something and end up with a mounted-turret-lion (although that would be ****ing badass)

and to think of the benefits something as simple as this could be.

Imagine if you will, a set of lizards have some kind of hereditary disease that eventually spreads to humans in some city and makes them all sick, but when it dies, traces of the disease die with it.

Transparent skin engineering abound, it can be studied while its at work, thus saving lives.


And notice all of this is for good reason, unless someone is rich and funds genetic scientist (something that could use more funding, seeing as how real important science seems to go underfunded...ie: nasa) decides they want pink haired turtles, then most of genetic science is for the good of humanity.

I highly doubt we'll have an insurgency of Khan and the eugenics wars among us...

 

[kam!]

That frog wasn't even genetically altered. That frog species has the genes to be transparent.
They found the gene and bred them till the trait showed.

But I'm for genetic engineering. That whole argument with some mad scientist creating some two
headed dinosaur-bird hybrid is rather weak IMO. It's not like you have to mix 2 liquids and 3 week later you have exploding rats.
You need rather expensive equipment.
And I don't fear that there will be any biological superweapon, because we already have the capabilities to create bio-weapons
or weapons that level entire cities.
The knowledge itself isn't dangerous, it's how you use it. And humanity already has a lot of deadly knowledge, and as far as I know we're still not extinct

 

[DaRkOwNs]

its as he said, these frogs are not only extremely unique and can only really be created by "persuasion" (not genetic engineering), but they cant live past 2 generations. not even by cross breeding, so whats the harm if we do this anyway?

its the basic "minority for the whole" argument. destroy the few for the sake of all. and this is a very few.

 

[Grega]

Transparent frogs. Whats next :s

Transparent mice.

In any case. While this isnt generic engeneering. I still kinda think its a bit weird.

I mean imagine this. You are forced to have sex with the uglyest woman in the world just cause some lab people wanted to see what your kids would look like XD

Other than that im fine with it as long as they dont actually temper with DNA.

God, KNOWS wtf he's doing, and has the power and authority to handle such things.

No he does not. If he knew what he was doing heed scrap the plan to create humans in the first place.

 

[kam!]

Transparent frogs. Whats next :s

Transparent mice.

In any case. While this isnt generic engeneering. I still kinda think its a bit weird.

I mean imagine this. You are forced to have sex with the uglyest woman in the world just cause some lab people wanted to see what your kids would look like XD

Other than that im fine with it as long as they dont actually temper with DNA.



No he does not. If he knew what he was doing heed scrap the plan to create humans in the first place.

The frogs didn't even have sex. It's mor like someone takes your sperm to impregnate the uglyest woman in the world to see what your children would look like.

 

[Almighty_Gir]

ugh...

i hate religion right now, so i'll throw my two cents in. although it probably won't make much sense.

if god, in his infinite wisdom, chose to gift us, man, with free will, and a mind which is capable of reasoning, logic, and curiosity. then why would he then write 10 commandments which are:


I am the lord thy god
Thou shalt have no other gods before me
Thou shalt not make for thyself an idol
Thou shalt not make wrongful use of the name of thy God
Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy
Honor thy Father and Mother
Thou shalt not murder
Thou shalt not commit adultery
Thou shalt not steal
Thou shalt not bear false witness
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's house.
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife

i know there are twelve there, but the differen religions like to mix and match them.

however, no where in there does it say, or even IMPLY, "thou shalt not use the knowledge gifted to you to benefit yourselves, or those around you". nor does it say anywhere "being the pinnacle of my creation, you are still not allowed to do harm to anything beneath you in order that you may better yourselves".

lol i love being biblical.

anyway, the point is, that is the ONLY recorded time, where god actually passed down law to man (oh and i freaking LOVE this bit:

You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and the fourth generation of those who reject me,

oh how holy...)

anything else, is just an interperatation by man, and is therefor completely useless as a religious debating tool.

the end.

 

[Mountain Dewd]

religious views incorporated into government and law leads to one thing: violence, it always has, and it always will

QFT

Religion has no place in how anything is run, anyone who devoutly believes the bible (or insert religious text here) is infallible, really has no right dictating what should and shouldn't be done with science.

Religion has had it's run dictating our actions, if we want to better ourselves, we're going to have to ignore it for the most part, which I'm fine with considering I'm not Christian, and neither is the entire world (contrary to what all Christians seem to believe) so I see no reason for the entire world to make sure any and all scientific research is up to the Christian moral code.

 

[J-Dude]

Why the Hell are you people so flippant and dismissive over that which is far above you? How DARE you take the word of God and laugh at it?! Do you even KNOW the kind of disrespect and downright blasphemy you're comitting? You act like the laws and the logic of man are above God. GOD: Supreme beign that created everything, yourself included! Do you really want to go and piss him off? What is WRONG with people anymore?! It's like good common sense has become the premium nowadays!