Planning a new computer.

[wheres_]

Now I'm really noob when it comes to this so if I can get some help making some informed decisions I would really appreciate it.

I'm going for a something pretty much made for games and 3d work.

I'm aiming to spend around AUS$1500-AUS$2500.
I don't know hardware or brands very well.

Whats the best I can do for this kinda money?

 

[Spunky]

Are we talking new everything? Monitor, keyboard, mouse, etc.? Or just system components?

 

[wheres_]

Just tower.

 

[Spunky]

https://secure.newegg.com/NewVersio...stNumber=11354587&WishListTitle=wheres_warren

Best I could do. All of the best components for the budget. Enjoy.

 

[wheres_]

I'm thinking more along the lines of quadcore, perhaps 4gbs of ram? But do you need to run vista to take advantage of that?

 

[kam!]

I'm thinking more along the lines of quadcore, perhaps 4gbs of ram? But do you need to run vista to take advantage of that?

Yea a quad core is just marginally more expensive, and RAM is cheap as hell nowadays.
Vista isn't as bad as it's made to be, and high end (dx10) gaming pretty much requires vista.

 

[Spunky]

A nice, overclocked dual core is so much better than the best of quad cores. Developers aren't even taking advantage of those other two cores yet, so you're best off sticking with a dual core for now and upgrading down the line, even if just to save money. That processor will run anything you throw at it (I can testify to that) and then some. It will be a long time before technology steps ahead of it. As for 4GB of RAM, go for it. You don't really need it, but it can't hurt.

Stick with Vista x86 for now. Down the line when you upgrade to a quad core, move up to Vista x64 so you can take full advantage of it. But dual cores generally don't see a performance increase from moving up to Vista x64 (or any 64-bit OS for that matter). Plus driver support still isn't where it should be for Vista x64. It's nicer than it used to be I hear, but it's nowhere near the kind of support Vista x86 has.

 

[Smeg]

I just built a new PC myself

Cost me $1900ish

New Gigabyte Case - GZ-FA1CA-ASS
Asus Burner DRW-2014L1T Sata 20x
Intel CPU Quad Core Q9300 6mb cache
Seagate 1 Terrabyte Sata2 32mb cache Hard Drive
Gigabyte 9800GTX 512mb PCIE DDR3 graphics card - Kicks Ass
Vista 64bit Home Premium to support quad core and my new
Kingston Hyper-X 800mhz DDR2 4gig ram - Didn't go DDR3 just too expensive right now
550watt Gigabyte Powersupply
Asus 22" LCD 2ms
and a 320watt UPS

Absolutely awesome system so you could get one similar for around the $2500 mark

 

[Spunky]

The system I put together blows that one away performance wise, for less money too.

 

[Quagmire]

The system I put together blows that one away performance wise, for less money too.

Except for the fact that warren lives in AUS and we don't use US dollars. I do agree with your opinion though on Quad cores, they don't really benefit you much unless you do lots of intense multi-tasking or CPU intensive work. I think you also need to review your definition of blowing out of the water, as both systems posted would how fairly similar performance results, plus SLI isn't always suited to everyone, especially being so close to next gen cards.

All prices are from IT ESTATE:

CPU: Core2 Duo E8400 $239
Cooling: Scythe NINJA PLUS Rev.B w/ 120mm fan $88
Motherboard: Gigabyte EP35-DS3 $118
Ram: 2GB Corsair DDR2 800Mhz 4-4-4-12 $88
VGA: Sparkle 8800GT 512mb $220
HDD: Samsung HD501JL SATA (7200RPM, 16Mb cache) x2 $190
PSU: Corsair HX620 Modular $149
Optical Drive: Samsung 20X DVD-RW SATA $30
Case: Antec 1200 Full tower case $242

Sub total: $1364

I'd be grabbing what you'd only need for the time being and save some cash here and there. The 9800GTX is nothing more then a G92 GTS Refresh and the 8800GT isn't drastically different in performance by contrast to a G92 8800GTS, so save yourself $130-$150~ thereabouts, especailly considering that June/July is when next gen Graphics cards from both camps will hit (With ATI soon expected to Paper Launch/Announce HD4xxx at the end of the month and Nvidia brining out 9900GTX & GTS, their "real slim shady" next gen lol).

 

[Spunky]

I have to disagree with all but the CPU there Quagmire. I'm well aware that he lives in Australia. I'm sure he could find them though. My build still has the best price : performance ratio.

The mobo you chose was a poor choice. No SLI. The video card was a poor choice. The 9800 GTX will run circles around it, and last quite a bit longer. Not to mention SLI support has gotten so much better with the 9 series, it's not even funny. The cooler is meh, I'd only go with it if you can't find a Freezer 7 Pro around there.

Basically, do your best to find what I've recommended, and if you aren't able to, fall back on the next best thing. But you should post whatever you're doing here before you do it so you don't make any mistakes.

 

[wheres_]

Yeah I'm not going to do anything silly with this, I want it all sorted before I buy anything.

The Quadcore is for my 3d work, I do lost of rendering and the benefit of 2 extra cores is a must.

I'd rather go a little more over the top than be stingy with this btw.

Also I'm rather fond of Ati cards even though I know nvidia is where it's at atm. How do the equivalent Ati cards stack up, in terms of performance and price?

 

[Quagmire]

I have to disagree with all but the CPU there Quagmire. I'm well aware that he lives in Australia. I'm sure he could find them though. My build still has the best priceerformance ratio.

Based on what? You missed the currency type... Despite that $1 AUD usually translates to anywhere between 90c-94c US (And sometimes a bit higher), despite that you are also not familiar with pricing here ni Australia of PC parts by contrast.

Also, don't just start pulling random comments out of your ass

-You disagree on CPU choice, despite the both of us recommending the same thing. I find that very laughable to say that you disagree and agree... Yeah...
-Your HSF sucks by contrast
-Your case sucks by contrast
-SLI isn't targeted towards everyone. Need I remind you that in a couple of months time next gen cards will be released? better he saves his money now. You are being delusional to yourself to make such a statement about SLI scaling at the same time too, 9800GTX and G92 8800GTS practically have no performance difference (And that Once I overclock my G92 GTS SLI @ 760/2050, I've practically closed the gap). SLI is also CPU limited and might not make all the difference.

The mobo you chose was a poor choice. No SLI. The video card was a poor choice. The 9800 GTX will run circles around it, and last quite a bit longer. Not to mention SLI support has gotten so much better with the 9 series, it's not even funny. The cooler is meh, I'd only go with it if you can't find a Freezer 7 Pro around there.

Also despite the fact that a single 9600GT loses to a 8800GT by 12%, 8800GT SLI supposedly would beat 9600GT SLI and 9600GT SLI > 8800GTS (G92)\G80 GTX.

I own a 780i, it's a different experience to own something and recommend it then not own it and recommend it... I've had minor problems with it (Nothing I can't solve when trouble shooring), but numerous other users seem to have their nic nacks at the 780i, not to mention that the MCP likes to heat up on a lot of reference designed boards. The ASUS Striker II Formula wasn't reference design and a rather decent board, but had a problem where the lan ports would constantly fail. A couple of weeks later after I returned mine for the eVGA 780i, Asus had only just released a BIOS update to resolve the problem. People also complain about the overclocking potential of the 780i by comparison to intel chipsets, so I don't see how it's "poor"...

Yeah I'm not going to do anything silly with this, I want it all sorted before I buy anything.

The Quadcore is for my 3d work, I do lost of rendering and the benefit of 2 extra cores is a must.

I'd rather go a little more over the top than be stingy with this btw.

Also I'm rather fond of Ati cards even though I know nvidia is where it's at atm. How do the equivalent Ati cards stack up, in terms of performance and price?

ATI's HD3870 is competition, but as you already know, anything nvidia slaughters it at this current point in time.

 

[Spunky]

The latest card from ATI is the Radeon 3870. It's a great card and competes well against the 8 series GeForce cards, but it cowers next to the new 9 series. I'd stick with the 9800 GTX there. As for a quad core, alrighty then. I'll revise the list.

Edit: Revised the list.

Quagmire, I said I disagreed with everything BUT the CPU. Read it again. My heatsink rules. I know because I use it. My case rules. I know because I use it. It's got amazing cooling which is why I chose it. Read the reviews.

As for SLI, I'm saying that's why he should do it down the line. Of course next-gen cards are right around the corner. Next-gen cards are always right around the corner. That's never going to change. That's like saying you should never make an upgrade path because something is always going to come out to stomp it flat, which is completely untrue.

Moving on to the 780i, I guess it's a good thing we're going with the EVGA model right off the bat then, isn't it? I don't think he's a power user, so he shouldn't experience any trouble with it. If he decides to play with the BIOS down the line, he can always ask for help here prior to doing so.

He's fine. Really he is.

 

[Quagmire]

My heatsink rules. I know because I use it. My case rules. I know because I use it. It's got amazing cooling which is why I chose it. Read the reviews.

And yet they suck by comparison to what I recommended, gee... Do yourself a favor and stop treating a forum as a popularity contest! Your cooler is nothing compared to a Thermalright Ultra 120 extreme for example, which is what I'd recommend he'd get. You can get them for $70 from Fluidtek (Which is not too far from IT Estate). The Scythe Rev.B also shares similar contrast with the TRUE120, it also has 6 heat pipes and similar cooling potential.

As for SLI, I'm saying that's why he should do it down the line. Of course next-gen cards are right around the corner. Next-gen cards are always right around the corner. That's never going to change. That's like saying you should never make an upgrade path because something is always going to come out to stomp it flat, which is completely untrue.

You're really the comedian, I don't know where you start to pull these comments out of your ass.

-I never said don't have a upgrade path at all, so you can stop being immature and putting words in my mouth thank you very much.

Moving on to the 780i, I guess it's a good thing we're going with the EVGA model right off the bat then, isn't it? I don't think he's a power user, so he shouldn't experience any trouble with it. If he decides to play with the BIOS down the line, he can always ask for help here prior to doing so.

What's will make it worth it as much a upgrade as a next gen card for him to get a 2nd card when he is CPU limited if he won't OC his CPU (Just about what nearly every SLI owner does to limit CPU bottlenecking associated with such a setup). We've known about the 9900 seires since not long after the 9800 series release and yet perofrmance of a 8800GTX today for example is really good, but where is the true next gen card with the performance leap over a card that has pretty much seen newer refreshed cards that share similar and slightly better performance as their predecessor that was released in late 2006? The 780i has it's own fair share of problems if you do your reading around the internet...

 

[Spunky]

Overclocking is fairly straightforward. If he doesn't understand, that's what we're here for. Down the line when he goes SLI, he can post here for help. Like he's doing now.

Do yourself a favor and stop treating a forum as a popularity contest!

LOL! The fact you would even say that leads me to shoot that right back at you.

You're really the comedian, I don't know where you start to pull these comments out of your ass.

Now you're getting angry. This is quite funny indeed. Oops, looks like I've done it again. My ass is really getting quite sore.

Also despite the fact that a single 9600GT loses to a 8800GT by 12%, 8800GT SLI supposedly would beat 9600GT SLI and 9600GT SLI > 8800GTS (G92)\G80 GTX.

No duh. We're not even comparing the 9600 GT here. I don't even know what the point of saying that was. The 9600 GT is the low end of the 9 series, of course it's going to be inferior to the top end of the 8 series. It's the same for the 7 series and the 8 series. The 7800 is far better than any of the low end 8 series cards. Pointless argument. At this point you're not even sticking to the subject.

I never said don't have a upgrade path at all, so you can stop being immature and putting words in my mouth thank you very much.

Why did you assume I'm trying to put words in your mouth? I'm merely reinforcing what I've been saying all along. Please, try to keep up. Please.

Edit: At this time...

1,609.88 USD = 1,725.94 AUD

I think I win the "popularity contest".

 

[Quagmire]

LOL! The fact you would even say that leads me to shoot that right back at you.

It's reflective of the way that you act, which is not too hard to see mind you!

Overclocking is fairly straightforward. If he doesn't understand, that's what we're here for. Down the line when he goes SLI, he can post here for help. Like he's doing now.

That's not entirely true as you'd like to believe it. On the 780i overclocking can be lack luster and take a little beat of tweaking, an example is adjusting the CPUL GTL REF voltage in the bios, something that quite a few people miss and as you know Overclocking always varies, so I don't see how your statement applies spectrum wide. If he doesn't know what he's doing, he won't get very far with overclocking. Think before you speak much?

Now you're getting angry. This is quite funny indeed. Oops, looks like I've done it again. My ass is really getting quite sore.

Heh, I've always seen this stupidity from you in the past with tech bench threads. You know me much better then you'd seem to think you do . Infact, I lol'd my ass off when you recommened that someone go out and buy a Asrock939 with a 6600GT AGP when reality set in you could get the PCI-E 6600GT cheaper new and save additional money for something else. Your budgeting and recommendations aren't exactly as smart as you make them out to be in that case .

No duh. We're not even comparing the 9600 GT here. I don't even know what the point of saying that was. The 9600 GT is the low end of the 9 series, of course it's going to be inferior to the top end of the 8 series. It's the same for the 7 series and the 8 series. The 7800 is far better than any of the low end 8 series cards. Pointless argument. At this point you're not even sticking to the subject.

You commented on 9 series scaling and there is a article you can find with benchmarks on the scaling to which you were referring too... In that case, why even mention 9 series scaling? I already told you that the 9800GTX by contrast to the 8800GTS G92 was hardly any different in terms of performance and the 8800GT isn't that far behind either... Again, why go SLI when the next gen card is just around the corner? Makes sense! I probably would of sold my 8800s come end of may.

So before you accuse me of not sticking to the subject, I'll also accuse you of not sticking to the subject. Stop proclaiming something and stop lying, simple! You burst out because you thought that your cooler and case were good by comparison to what I recommended, which are better mind you regardless of how much you refuse to believe that. I also happen to live in Australia, so I have a one up on you when it comes to finding out product availability here and the likes. You'd probably end up finding the case you recommended for example on PC Case Gear, and they charge shipping costs as it is extra. That's a overhead no one would really want to deal with when they can buy it and save on the overheard by comparison.

 

[wheres_]

Btw guys I appreciate you putting so much effort into this, it will really help me in the long run.

Hopefully you can both come to some kinda middle ground which will be my perfect machine

btw im not accutaly going to finalize this until July, when I get more money and can get quotes from all around the place.

 

[Spunky]

It's reflective of the way that you act, which is not too hard to see mind you!

Of course it's not. I see what I want to see all of the time. It's quite easy.

That's not entirely true as you'd like to believe it. On the 780i overclocking can be lack luster and take a little beat of tweaking, an example is adjusting the CPUL GTL REF voltage in the bios, something that quite a few people miss and as you know Overclocking always varies, so I don't see how your statement applies spectrum wide. If he doesn't know what he's doing, he won't get very far with overclocking. Think before you speak much?

Even if that's true, it's still not too difficult to walk him through it. You're just blind firing at me now by stating the obvious. Key word of this thread: support.

Heh, I've always seen this stupidity from you in the past with tech bench threads. You know me much better then you'd seem to think you do . Infact, I lol'd my ass off when you recommened that someone go out and buy a Asrock939 with a 6600GT AGP when reality set in you could get the PCI-E 6600GT cheaper new and save additional money for something else. Your budgeting and recommendations aren't exactly as smart as you make them out to be in that case .

Yeah, congratulations. You got me there. I happened to not know that at the time. What the hell does this even have to do with now? Nothing, you're just blind firing some more. It's okay. I get it. Really I do. It's not like you have a whole lot to work with in this argument. Take your time.

You commented on 9 series scaling and there is a article you can find with benchmarks on the scaling to which you were referring too... In that case, why even mention 9 series scaling? I already told you that the 9800GTX by contrast to the 8800GTS G92 was hardly any different in terms of performance and the 8800GT isn't that far behind either... Again, why go SLI when the next gen card is just around the corner? Makes sense! I probably would of sold my 8800s come end of may.

Because, again, the 9 series has better support for SLI.

So before you accuse me of not sticking to the subject, I'll also accuse you of not sticking to the subject. Stop proclaiming something and stop lying, simple! You burst out because you thought that your cooler and case were good by comparison to what I recommended, which are better mind you regardless of how much you refuse to believe that. I also happen to live in Australia, so I have a one up on you when it comes to finding out product availability here and the likes. You'd probably end up finding the case you recommended for example on PC Case Gear, and they charge shipping costs as it is extra. That's a overhead no one would really want to deal with when they can buy it and save on the overheard by comparison.

Okay. Why didn't you say this from the beginning? That would have saved us all of this time, and we (well, you really) wouldn't have destroyed warren's poor thread. Shame, shame.

Any more pot shots you want to take at me before we do the unthinkable and actually get back to helping warren, who is probably crying as we rampage across his thread?

 

[Zeonix]

Uh...maybe you should buy a pre-built PC from a company. Or ask elsewhere.