Piccolo

[Chang Wufei]

I am fully aware on how to "use his amazing techniques." And I am fully aware that anyone with a reaction time can successfully avoid any serious damage from these techniques.

Ask anyone from ~kai~, I go out of my way because eyelaser kills amuse me so much. It doesn't change the fact that the damage they deal for the ki they cost is minimal, and requires targets who don't like moving and enjoy being smacked around. Freiza's laser is INFINATLY better because the ki cost and damage is done in an instant- beyond that, you can be charging. For every MILLISECOND one is fireing eyelasers, they arn't recharging ki. It's high cost to actually finish off an entire laser is quite an offset, as your opponent will more than likely be ready to attack by this point and you're going to be down that much ki.

Scattershot is borked, is broken, is busted. Regardless of distance, you can guarantee many of ones shots to just detonate wherever they are regardless of when you right click. The only time it is "deadly" is when one gets smashed into the ground with a slow recovering charecter who also forgets to hold spacebar, so the piccolo can fire them without the need to right click. Otherwise, they're both laughable and saddening because they actually have potential.

Speed is the most important aspect in most situations; most of the "slow" charecters have an ability or two to offset this. Freiza has the laser, Gohan and Trunks have fast trans, Krillin is a BEAST when he transes, and Piccolo has to wait for one million PL in order to get a crappy multiplier and a crappy trans.

Please don't delude yourself into thinking he's a good charecter. Dieing to him is in many ways more humiliating than dieing to an untransed Gohan or Krillin; Krillin's got spam moves you have to worry about constantly, Gohan's got quick techniques at low ki cost such as the shield and in some circumstances the power beam. Trunks has multi-hit, and Freiza is just plain deadly. What does Piccolo have? He's a mess and a hybrid of all the other charecters; he does the same things as basically most of them, but poorly.

Please, don't go around insulting people when they realize a charecter is flawed; provide reasons other than "I AM VERY GOOD" to back your statements. Otherwise, it comes off as both degrading and insulting.



Don't get me wrong; Piccolo is a great concept. Very origional and great potential. He's just got a few design flaws (Masenko is garbage compared to the power beam, eye lasers are too weak for their high ki cost, and scatter needs to not randomly explode regardless of distance when right clicked, trans is iffy) which make him... less than satisfactory when compared to the others.

i think that suifficiantly deserves a "pwned"

back ontopic...i also only use piccolo when i feel like messing around..i never take piccolo seriously..i find him too...weak..as nge pretty much said...i like piccolo as a character..like..as eye candy...because the model for him is awsome..but i never really use him unless i feel like bashing newbs..

 

[Adaptus]

I posted a suggestion to improve Piccolo's Scattershot:

http://forum.esforces.com/showthread.php?t=61331

I think it might help to make at least one of Piccolo's attacks more useful.

 

[DaRkOwNs]

why is piccolo so slow anyway?

i mean he was basically even with goku in the saiyan saga he should be just a little bit slower than goku and vegeta but should be faster than trunks and gohan (which he isnt)

 

[michalmermer]

Maybe his transformations should be easier to achive as in the film he only have to put hand on the host.

 

[Ravendust]

why is piccolo so slow anyway?

i mean he was basically even with goku in the saiyan saga he should be just a little bit slower than goku and vegeta but should be faster than trunks and gohan (which he isnt)

I think the team look at each character in terms of characteristics rather than 'so and so was faster than so and so at this point in the series'. For instance, Piccolo was a powerhouse. In the fight against #17 they had a little dialogue about how #17 was much faster, but Piccolo had the advantage in strength.

 

[Kaination]

Man, why am I the only one who is good with picollo?

knockback --> eyelazer ftw o/

 

[Skiwan]

scattershot is easily the most awesome attack in the game, he has eye lazers too (as mentioned =P) and he has sbc, quick firing, powerful, doesnt cost much ki. Piccolo is awesome, but eh, his speed and pl settings arent that great =\... 1.3 shud sort that out though

 

[nge]

Kaination. Everyone and their mother knows this "trick." Eyelasers are costly and time consuming. They are underpowered, especially compared to fingerlaser.

I can't figure it out. What is it with the need of people to say how great they are with a charecter because many say this charecter is underpowered? There are facts behind it, and the only people who dispute it end up disputing it with something along the lines of "I OWN U JUST DON'T KNOW WAT UR DOING>"

Look, this isn't about personal skill. I'm betting I could beat a great majority of you Piccolo on Piccolo; even if I couldn't, who cares? The point of my posts is to attempt to show how underpowered he is. I'm glad other people have come to see the light, or have already realized this for a time as well. I'm also glad other people have appreciated what I have to say on this topic.

I don't mean any offence with my words, but I cannot comprehend what causes people to respond as such. There is no denying Piccolo, when compared to every other charecter, is underpowered.

Piccolo is a cool concept; a jack of all trades charecter. The problem is; he really is the king of none, but to the point that having his other abilities comes as no real advantage. He can do pretty much everything; the problem is he does everything poorly. He is in need of a few buffs, at the least.

 

[Sonic the Vampire]

Historically I've never had trouble using Piccolo in ESF. You are all underplaying the hell out of scattershot. It isn't a homing technique, it's just a massively powerful version of rapid ki blasts. The SBC is mobile and highly explosive, and god frobid you fire a beam at Piccolo because he'll smash your ass in a struggle with them. His eye lasers aren't super useful except to bug your opponent when he's at medium range trying to power up, but masenko can even pack a punch if you hit somebody with it. Piccolo is just hard to use effectively, especially against somebody with speed. If the argument is that speed is his greatest flaw, the same could be said for krillin, normal gohan, or trunks. Piccolo's prime was over after the first season of dragonball Z, and he was never known for having great speed.

 

[michalmermer]

"In the fight against #17 they had a little dialogue about how #17 was much faster, but Piccolo had the advantage in strength."

He acctualy said "You have good speed , but lack in power" what means that they have the same speed but piccolo was stronger.This is my favorite fight in dbz and i watch it quite often - piccolo always have the iniative even if C-17 hit him he was able to defend from next punches.About power of Piccolo in sayian saga -Piccolo was third After songo,vegeta but vegeta has lack in speed.

 

[nge]

I understand that scattershot is not a homing technique, and nor should it be. However, making it so they don't detonate half the time before they get to the target would be a nice fix, giving them some use aside a better way to deal damage to people on the ground who have a slow recovery time who also forget to hold spacebar.

The "problem," as you put it, was covered with a fair amount of depth earlier.

Scattershot is borked, is broken, is busted. Regardless of distance, you can guarantee many of ones shots to just detonate wherever they are regardless of when you right click. The only time it is "deadly" is when one gets smashed into the ground with a slow recovering charecter who also forgets to hold spacebar, so the piccolo can fire them without the need to right click. Otherwise, they're both laughable and saddening because they actually have potential.

Speed is the most important aspect in most situations; most of the "slow" charecters have an ability or two to offset this. Freiza has the laser, Gohan and Trunks have fast trans, Krillin is a BEAST when he transes, and Piccolo has to wait for one million PL in order to get a crappy multiplier and a crappy trans.

Please don't delude yourself into thinking he's a good charecter. Dieing to him is in many ways more humiliating than dieing to an untransed Gohan or Krillin; Krillin's got spam moves you have to worry about constantly, Gohan's got quick techniques at low ki cost such as the shield and in some circumstances the power beam. Trunks has multi-hit, and Freiza is just plain deadly. What does Piccolo have? He's a mess and a hybrid of all the other charecters; he does the same things as basically most of them, but poorly.

Please, don't go around insulting people when they realize a charecter is flawed; provide reasons other than "I AM VERY GOOD" to back your statements. Otherwise, it comes off as both degrading and insulting.



Don't get me wrong; Piccolo is a great concept. Very origional and great potential. He's just got a few design flaws (Masenko is garbage compared to the power beam, eye lasers are too weak for their high ki cost, and scatter needs to not randomly explode regardless of distance when right clicked, trans is iffy) which make him... less than satisfactory when compared to the others.

As others mentioned, his SBC is a good technique but due to Cell's speed advantage and PL advantage, he can simply use the SBC better. The masenko is not a good attack for the ki it costs. Dealing no more damage than the powerbeam for the ki cost of a mouthblast, AND sacrificing mobility while it charges is quite a gamble. The most you can do with it is drift, which most players should be able to recognize/react to before the time it's ready to fire, and the huge ki cost and low chance of hitting compared to other beams of the same ki cost make it too much of a risk to be practical.



What I can't understand is, why some cannot accept that a charecter is indeed flawed. This has nothing to do with a personal vendetta, or choosing Piccolo and getting owned, or any of that crap. I analyzed the charecter, and brought out my analyzations for others to see after I'd made sure they were correct. A few tweaks could fix this, and make him a contender. Right now, he's just... a mess.

 

[Sonic the Vampire]

Since Cell has no PL advantage, particularly after transformation, he cannot SBC better. Cell starts with slightly higher PL, and after he transforms he loses chunks of it every time he dies. Masenko does more damage than a power beam, although it could and will be pumped up. Last I checked Scattershot doesn't blow itself up unless you're standing next to a mountain or the ground, and you don't have to be rolling along the ground to make it useful. Someone charging an attack, firing an attack, and recoiling after a melee blow are always vulnarable if you time the homing click. It does more damage than a ki blast and it fires faster, with a better explosive radius.

"What I can't understand is, why some cannot accept that a charecter is indeed flawed."

That doesn't make your argument, it makes you look pompous; however, I will agree that his techniques could all use some general tweaking. Bringing his speed *closer* to other characters would be a boon as well, provided he stayed a little bit slower to maintain that disadvantage.

 

[nge]

Well, yes. I was under the impression you were saying he was fine as is. I'm not suggesting any major overhaul, but tweaks are very nessessary.

On the slow character issue, I feel all the slow characters ought to be brought up to around 195-205, varied from character to character. I agree that he should not be as fast as some, but the slow characters are perhaps too slow as is.

I'm not trying to come accross as pompous, but previously I was under the impression you believed that there was nothing wrong with Piccolo. I was under the impression you were being stubborn; you showed me in that last post I was mistaken, and for that I apologise.

Perhaps the right click feature on scattershot is frame dependant- on my faster computer when I had one, it almost never exploded unnessessarily, but on my slower one half the shots just ended up exploding uselessly should mouse2 even be touched.

I have tested the powerbeam vs masenko. Ask Silent Criket to verify this (at least I believe it was with him when I did this test.) I was a gohan with a pl of 830,000 PL non-turbo, and he was a stock Piccolo in turbo resulting in 812,000 PL. We charged beams, his turbo vs my turbo. As soon as they connected, mine started winning slightly, yet they were both fully charged. That small of a PL gap would not have mattered much if the Masenko were stronger, as the distance between us could have been covered by one teleport.

Cell's got an early PL advantage, which does indeed matter quite a bit. Piccolo starts with a weaker attack vs Cell; this is fine as it is simply a case of higher PL = stronger beam. What speed Cell has with this attack makes him simply better with it; that's fine too. Unfortunatly, Piccolo's other abilities don't make up for what he lacks vs Cell and their similarities. That was the issue I was trying to make apparent, but I ought to have worded it better.

 

[Malarky]

i'd rather play krillen than piccolo, leest u got sumit to look forward to

 

[Damaera]

To me, Piccolo is perfect the way he is, he has the perfect speed and the perfect damage. Scattershot may be buggy, but the rest of his moves are perfect.

 

[nge]

Well? Why? Where is the evidence behind this line of thought?

 

[sub]

Since Cell has no PL advantage, particularly after transformation, he cannot SBC better. Cell starts with slightly higher PL, and after he transforms he loses chunks of it every time he dies.

If the server has pl catchup off like most servers do, cell does indeed have a pl advantage. Even if he did not, the sbc is piccolos one good move and another character, a better character, can do it.

As for the scattershot, on my computer, half of the shots always blow up in my face dealing me a good amount of damage. The eyelazer is good for shooting people who are powering up, but it alone does not make up for the fact that piccolo is underpowered. As for his Masenko, I believe it does less damage than Gohans power beam at a larger ki cost.

I guess I'm really asking why would anyone choose Piccolo over someone like Goku or Cell?

Btw, this isn't just for Piccolo. I personally feel Gohan, Krillin and trunks are all underpowered also.

 

[Damaera]

Well? Why? Where is the evidence behind this line of thought?

Why would I need evidence on my own opinion?

 

[Skiwan]

I used to use piccolo all the time when i started playing 1.2, scattershot was fine before the updates, and imo, scattersot > any other attack in the game, apart from maybe say, throw -> finger laser, but we all know how cheap that is. Scattershot has multiple opurtunities for attack and costs very little ki, you can replace where u'd use normal ki basts, as well as other oppurtunities where you'd normally charge a generic beam, but scattershot does a hell of a lot more damage and is also instant. He also has a lazer, which has a more control/usability for attack than finger laser (imo), and when at a higher pl it will do a ****load of damage, especially with turbo. He is slow, and his trans doesnt do much for him, aside from needing fixing scattershot, i think his attacks are really well thought out, all pretty fast attacks which can be intergrated quite nicely with melee. One thing i think they should add that ball attack he had. forgotten what its called... charged ball that homes in on target.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

more attacks would be nice.

cell has alot of attacks, goku has a lot of attacks, i just think he should be tweaked and that all players should have a certain amount of attacks to balance everyone out.