New beam type?

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In addition to Balls, and Beam type attacks, I'm proposing wave's, which are basically attack's which cause area effect damage without an explosion or knockback.

Secondary attack form of:
Kamehameha (Goku, Gohan, Cell, Krillin)
Galit Gun (Vegeta, Cell)
Masenko (Picollo, Gohan)
Mouth Blast (Buu)

Primary form of attack for:
Flamethrower? (Trunks)

I don't know if Freeza has any attacks that would be suitable for this in 1.3

Advantages:

Will not explode no matter how close you fire at a target, so you recievie no area effect damage from the explosion

The closer your target it is, the more damage that is sustained.

Somewhat less of a charge time than a normal beam, allowing for quick use in a battle where your opponent is temporarily down, and nearby.

Can damage multiple opponents if they're within the cone of effect

Can struggle with another wave (like Cell and Gohan did at the end of that saga)

Disadvantages:

Somewhat increased ki costs

Attack become's significantly weaker the farther away it gets from its user

No shockwave or explosion radius, as the attack fades when completed.

Beam attacks can be fired into the front of the wave and will not cause a struggle (damage taken by the one fireing the wave is reduced, but still potent)

 
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Could work, you thought it through, I kinda like it, so it's like a transparent wave of energy that spreads out in a "cone"? I give it a thumbs up :)
 
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Nah, not transparent.

What he's proposing is instead of an exploding mode for attacks, they have a 'scorching' effect that damages them when they're within the attack's area of effect. Kind of like the Ki-blobs, only these waves will move like Beam attacks.

I think it's an okay idea, but it'd be more effort than it's worth.
 
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True it would be more effort but if beams were that way no one would ever have to worry about spamming. Or at least as much
 
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@Donnierisk: Thanks ^^

@Shiyojin Rommyu: I hadn't thought about like a ki-blob but that's exactly how it would act, yep.
You yourself agree that its a good idea, if you have an addition that would make it "worthwhile" it definitely couldn't hurt.

@Dark_Trunks: Well it wouldn't replace current beam attacks. It would be more of a secondary function to some of the existing ones.
 
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Well, in order to make it worthwhile, you first have to think about this - what could make this useful? What could allow this to do something that normal beams can't?

Well, what do normal beams do? Explode on contact. You already mentioned this - your wave-style attack doesn't explode, so it keeps the user safe from splash-damage. However, it also doesn't do instant damage, like explosions do, so you need to keep the enemy within the wave's range in order to inflict damage.

I think the wave-beams would have to have a high damage ratio in order to be useful. If a person gets caught in a wave-beam, there's no way he'll stay put for long - he'll dash out of the wave's range.

Waves should have a wide range, much wider than normal beams (think 4 times a Kamehameha) in order to be useful.

It'd look really cool, too, shooting a massive beam like that. :3

As for Ki cost - I think it should be slightly less than a normal beam attack, but it should cost more during struggles.
 
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Great ideas ^^
The only thing I'd like to tweak would be the damage ratio/charge time.

I was thinking that instead of having the regular charge bar for attacks, character's would simply chant the name of the attack, and then fire the wave right after that at full strength.
If they're just a couple of feet from the character they have a chance to inflict massive damage (ex. Goku performing Warp Kamehameha on Cell during their and blowing off the top half of his body)
Alternately, at maximum range the attack is little more than a gentle wash

Advantages:

- Quck release (right after attack chant), and little time to avoid or block the attack
- Uses a set amount of ki during its duration (unless it initiates a ps), but does differeing levels of damage
- If blocked at close range, the attack knock's back any opponents a significant distance. If they strike another player or surface, then its like they were thrown and the receive a similar amount of damage

Disadvantages:

- When blocked, wave types do 95% less damage
- There is no block struggle iniatiated at any range
- Audio cues let player's know when you're going to fire a wave vs a beam (Ex. goku might chant Kamehameha different when he fires a beam as opposed to firing a wave)
 
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heres my output:
1. does more damage at closer range
2. very fast charge (not gen beam fast more like masenko speed)
3. can swoop with it, but immediately stops when fired
now for disadvantages:
1. beam is uncontrollable
2. beam is big and slow (just a little bigger than buu, slow as destructo disc)
3. pushes opponent back so tath the first second does the most damage then continues to diminish
4. uses a continuous amount of ki

for effects the beam would fan out like in the top half of that picture but immediately focus itself into a big cylinder, if youve ever play buus fury for the gameboy it would look like vegetas final flash
 
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DaRkOwNs said:
heres my output:
1. does more damage at closer range
yep ^^

2. very fast charge (not gen beam fast more like masenko speed)

A nice alternative for the almost insta-fire, but one of the things I'd liked about this attack would be using it to strike at an opponent you just melee'd into the ground. I kinda wanted this to be used or thought of mainly as a finisher, or failing that a surprise attack. People would keep use gen beams/ball because they do a decent amount of damage and take little ki, and would use the wave attacks to deal potentially harsher damage at a slightly slower pace but with more of a drain on their energy/stamina. The worth of the attack would all depend on how you positioned yourself after knocking them into the ground.

3. can swoop with it, but immediately stops when fired

I don't think that's such a good idea. I dunno about anyone else, but the last thing I'd want is to have a dozen people flying around with those things ready to pop off at a moment's notice. That'd make it almost as deadly as Goku's ability to teleport while charging . . . except everyone would have it.

now for disadvantages:
1. beam is uncontrollable

Naturally ^^

2. beam is big and slow (just a little bigger than buu, slow as destructo disc)

That sounds too slow, but I haven't used or fought anyone with a disc for a while, so I dunno. I'd always thought of the attack as being something like a flashlight, though for balancing and powerstruggling that probably wouldn't be such a great idea. Maybe around the speed of the Final Flash would be good.

3. pushes opponent back so tath the first second does the most damage then continues to diminish

Nice :3

4. uses a continuous amount of ki
That's what I'd meant. I wish I'd made it more clear ;/

for effects the beam would fan out like in the top half of that picture but immediately focus itself into a big cylinder, if youve ever play buus fury for the gameboy it would look like vegetas final flash

Well I haven't played that game, but I've played some dbz mugen's where the beam effects are similar to what you're describing. I think that works better in a 2d fighting game though. As this attack is supposed to be able to hit multiple opponents at the same time I think a cone would work best as the shape of the attack.
silly message length limitations
 
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pretty good idea, more ways to fire beams, with its advantages and disadvantages.

I probably like this one more then the regular beam we have. It spreads out nicely, hitting more then one opponent, and doesnt have that splash damage effect. So far you guys are doing a good job balancing it out.

Another thing you could add is that if two waves come into contact with each other sideways, they are more susceptible to being instantly deflected in the other direction (saving teammates, etc)
 
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This sounds like a good addition to the attacks. BUT heres my question. What effect does the wave attacks have on Gohans energy shield? Would it break it instantly? Or would it drain it extremely fast.
 
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tonythetiger123 said:
Another thing you could add is that if two waves come into contact with each other sideways, they are more susceptible to being instantly deflected in the other direction (saving teammates, etc)
Now that would be tight. There have been only a few times where I've seen a beam heading towards a guy charging the spirit bomb on our team, and been able to stop it so he could finish the attack and take out half of the other team ^^

I guess it could act kinda of like how water effects the beams now.

Allivan said:
This sounds like a good addition to the attacks. BUT heres my question. What effect does the wave attacks have on Gohans energy]shield? Would it break it instantly? Or would it drain it extremely fast.
I'm thinking that when the shield is hit by a wave attack its user's ki supply is drained at rate dependant on the range of the wave user's.
Close = Very fast drain before damage is taken to hp.
Far: Minimal drain

The user ESFbandit does not have posting privileges therefore his post and your response have been removed. Apologies for any inconvenience. - Pain
 
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I like this idea as well, but I was wondering about the actual effect, will it be a sprite, a sprite field, a particle field, a shader ?How does it expanse, how does it move ?
 
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Now that I'm not sure about. I don't think a sprite like the way beams are handled would provide the necessary volume for the attack . . . maybe a model with special shader and particle effects would work best.
Perhaps it could even be animated; the wave would fluctuate over the period of its life time.

It wouldn't be controllabe once you fire it though. To redirect it you'd have to release the first attack, then aim, charge, and fire a new one in he new in another direction.
I wouldn't want anyone just bathing/spamming the entire map in wave attack before getting taken down =/
 
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I love this idea and here is what i came up with for how it could work.

before explaining understand this.. IN the show it didn't take players alot of energy to SUmmon beam attacks. It took alot of energy to Shoot and control them.

Takes about half a second longer then a gen beam to power up.
This attack should only cost the same amount of ki a Gen beam/ball would take to power up, but when fired it takes a chunk of ki out of you. If you have enough ki then your beam attack is a FULL BLAST beam attack. If you dont have enough ki then the beam will be weaker then normal depending on how much energy went into the beam.

Also i think you should be able to swoop and fly around with this attack and even teleport.

When the beam is fired it should have it should only have a range of about 1 to 2 teleports long before the beam fades out, and the Damage depends on the range. The closer the more damage. The beam also shouldn't be instant but instead it should gradually move from point A to point B in about .5 to 2 seconds. When fired the beam cannot be turned and the beam is like a BUllet you dont put more ki into it..its like an all or nothing shot.

also if player is killed with this kind of beam attack then he/she is vaporized not blown to bits.

And maybe the sprites used to powerup would be similar to the sprites used for this beam attack
 
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I still think this is a great idea. Lets say that these waves have that scorching effect up close. And if someone dies from it, he will get vaporized by the wave and let out a scream to let everyone know ;p.
 
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Shiyojin Rommyu said:
Well, in order to make it worthwhile, you first have to think about this - what could make this useful? What could allow this to do something that normal beams can't?

Well, what do normal beams do? Explode on contact. You already mentioned this - your wave-style attack doesn't explode, so it keeps the user safe from splash-damage. However, it also doesn't do instant damage, like explosions do, so you need to keep the enemy within the wave's range in order to inflict damage.

I think the wave-beams would have to have a high damage ratio in order to be useful. If a person gets caught in a wave-beam, there's no way he'll stay put for long - he'll dash out of the wave's range.

Waves should have a wide range, much wider than normal beams (think 4 times a Kamehameha) in order to be useful.

It'd look really cool, too, shooting a massive beam like that. :3

As for Ki cost - I think it should be slightly less than a normal beam attack, but it should cost more during struggles.
What about, a no ki-costing charge time, but can deplete ki rapidly when fired. That can keep people from holding it down for too long.
 
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My only suggestion is to make it so that you can't immediately cancel the attack. Once you're shooting the wave thing, you should be forced to remain in place for at least a second. This would give someone the time required to counter the attack.
 
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I agree with Zeo on this. It could be abused to no end if you weren't forced to be stuck in one place for at least 1 second.

Also, how big is the radius of the cone? Would it be the same as SSJ4 Gogeta doing 10x BBKKH or would it be way different?
 
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Awsome idea. I actually really like it. It'd give you that feeling of power. Yet it's not spammable. Awsome job. Thumbs up from me.
 

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