Negative ki bar

Should ki be able to go to negative? (read before voting)

  • Excellent/Fantastic/Cool/Wonderful/ idea and should be in for sure soon.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Good/ nice idea that should be in sometime in the future.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Average/ Ok that maybe should be put in.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Bad/ Dumb idea that should not be put in.

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Crap/ Stupid/ Thrash idea that should never be put in.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0
New Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2003
Messages
165
Best answers
0
your wrong about how long the shiled lasts. one time i had gohan with perfect trans and a huge pl and i had the shiled going for about at least 10 mins, than some one shot a full kame into it and crashed the server.

on-topic: well i think it would just make more beam spammers
 
New Member
Joined
Dec 9, 2002
Messages
19
Best answers
0
How the heck does this idea create more beam spammers? To the tell the truth, I barley see and gohans in any servers, let alone them using shield. And it's the coding of the shields fault that the server crashed, so what are u complaining about.

If people are smart, they would ignore all people using a shield.
I think this idea would acually make the shield more useful.
 
New Member
Joined
Dec 10, 2002
Messages
6
Best answers
0
This idea has nothing to do with shields, and yeah I don't see how this will cause more beam spammers. I think it will acually reduce the amount of beam spammers because people will be more careful using their ki's.
 
New Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2003
Messages
1
Best answers
0
I think this is a cool feature for the game. It's realistic and can't really be spammed or abused. I do think that it will reduce beam spamming, not increase it. Right now shields are pretty useless, when I see someone using it, I just leave or wait until it goes off. This will acually relate to the show because Gohan protected Krillen and Picollo while they where weak.
 
New Member
Joined
Dec 31, 2002
Messages
99
Best answers
0
Guys....Are you sure you play esf?

Vegeta and trunks and gohan himself are the only guys with an attack that can not go through shield.
Goku: Solar flare
Krillin: Flare, disk
Buu: Candy beam
Cell: Disk, flare
Freiza: Disk, laser
Piccolo: Eye beam


See?
 
New Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Messages
109
Best answers
0
ANOTHER POINT AGAINSt:
Bloking non beams would be really ez since your only limit is the wall!

What do you care if you need some time to recharge, and meanwhile you get killed? YOU JUST KILED EVERYONE WITH A GREAT ATTAK OR RETURNING A SOUL BOMB!

If you are in a powerstruggle, ki, wich is one of the defining items of it, doesnt matter!


Let me get something straigt, in negative KI, you cant fly, you cant run, but you can fire beams?

If you cant fire beams, poor freeza! He would have to sneak and kill people who dont see them with his freeza discs all the time meanwhile other make super kamehamehas and blow everything up!

YOU SHOULD THINK OF THE IDEAS AS SOMETHING THAT WOULD HELP YOU FREE THE WOLRD OF VILLIANS, DONT JUST THINK YOU WILL KILL EASIER, THINK YOU WILL GET KILLED EASIER

Ill keep thinking negative things
 
New Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2002
Messages
561
Best answers
0
Originally posted by Yedi
ANOTHER POINT AGAINSt:
1. Bloking non beams would be really ez since your only limit is the wall!

2. What do you care if you need some time to recharge, and meanwhile you get killed? YOU JUST KILED EVERYONE WITH A GREAT ATTAK OR RETURNING A SOUL BOMB!

3. If you are in a powerstruggle, ki, wich is one of the defining items of it, doesnt matter!


4. Let me get something straigt, in negative KI, you cant fly, you cant run, but you can fire beams?
If you cant fire beams, poor freeza! He would have to sneak and kill people who dont see them with his freeza discs all the time meanwhile other make super kamehamehas and blow everything up!
1. Blocking non beams would be no different to now. When you say "non beams" I guess you mean things like Vegeta's Final Flash and the Special Beam Cannon. Remember: *The maximum power that a Ki attack can be has a set limit* that limi is set when you charge the attack up. Once that charge bar hits maximum, the attack gets no stronger, it just costs you Ki to hold the attack in your hands. So this idea of negative ki would not affect blocking these kinds of attacks. It would only give you the OPTION of trying to block it for longer IF you want to risk slower movement, no flying, knockout for a short period of time.

It DOES give the blocker a slight upper hand. For instance, if the blocker blocks a fully charged beam and they have only 25% ki in their pool. The ycan use their negative Ki to continue blocking it (benefits the blocker) but they pay the price for using that negative ki (does not benefit hte blocker). The choice comes down to the physic human playing the game.


2. The max power of all these ki attacks is set. It cant be increased by using neg-ki. It CAN be increased by a block or power struggle. But then again, what difference is it of starting a block struggle with 25% ki and using 75% negative ki to win that struggle, and using 100% positive ki (like we have now)?

The difference is this: If you were to use negative ki, you hurt your character's abilities. If you didnt have negative ki, you would lose the struggle and take the hit regardless. But if you had full ki, you would win the struggle and the huge explosion that occurs happens anyway.

Negative ki wont increase the damage that massive explosions do. The massive explosions are already in the game.


3. If Ki is a defining point of a power struggle, then how can negative Ki nullify that? Negative ki is: extra ki you CHOOSE to use in a struggle at the expense of your characters abilities. It just makes the struggles last longer if the players choose to.

4. Yes frieza might be disadvantaged a bit by this. But he has no beams either way. So he is "disadvantaged" with or without it. Maybe it is an advantage for him because he will never get to have the bad effects of using neg-ki except for in block struggles.
 
New Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Messages
109
Best answers
0
Originally posted by catfish
1. Blocking non beams would be no different to now. When you say "non beams" I guess you mean things like Vegeta's Final Flash and the Special Beam Cannon. Remember: *The maximum power that a Ki attack can be has a set limit* that limi is set when you charge the attack up. Once that charge bar hits maximum, the attack gets no stronger, it just costs you Ki to hold the attack in your hands. So this idea of negative ki would not affect blocking these kinds of attacks. It would only give you the OPTION of trying to block it for longer IF you want to risk slower movement, no flying, knockout for a short period of time.

It DOES give the blocker a slight upper hand. For instance, if the blocker blocks a fully charged beam and they have only 25% ki in their pool. The ycan use their negative Ki to continue blocking it (benefits the blocker) but they pay the price for using that negative ki (does not benefit hte blocker). The choice comes down to the physic human playing the game.


2. The max power of all these ki attacks is set. It cant be increased by using neg-ki. It CAN be increased by a block or power struggle. But then again, what difference is it of starting a block struggle with 25% ki and using 75% negative ki to win that struggle, and using 100% positive ki (like we have now)?

The difference is this: If you were to use negative ki, you hurt your character's abilities. If you didnt have negative ki, you would lose the struggle and take the hit regardless. But if you had full ki, you would win the struggle and the huge explosion that occurs happens anyway.

Negative ki wont increase the damage that massive explosions do. The massive explosions are already in the game.


3. If Ki is a defining point of a power struggle, then how can negative Ki nullify that? Negative ki is: extra ki you CHOOSE to use in a struggle at the expense of your characters abilities. It just makes the struggles last longer if the players choose to.

4. Yes frieza might be disadvantaged a bit by this. But he has no beams either way. So he is "disadvantaged" with or without it. Maybe it is an advantage for him because he will never get to have the bad effects of using neg-ki except for in block struggles.

1/2-jojojo the thing is that while being on negative ki, you can just hide! there are some maps where, if you fall from fly, you get to a rare place and you can rest, like kami, you slowly walk to the bottom.
You really care for 1 death after killing 5 in one blow?

3-You dont choose,what if the beams start going up and both are traped in that useless powerstruggle, until it reaches the ceiling?

4-omg can you believe what you are saying?
You said:-Maybe it is an advantage for him because he will never get to have the bad effects of using neg-ki except for in block struggles. -
JA:laff: JA:laff: And if every class looks at their ki bar once in a while they would notice their amount of ki left and...
QUOTE: "will never get to have the bad effects of using neg-ki "

Its a disadvantage because every other class has an advantage

Cant you just admit some things!?!?!

I thought of something new: Ki is also involved in bloking, recovering, swooping and attacking in melee. Once again blocking is not matter of ki but of life and how you block.
Recovers from melle wich are a great ocation everyone looks for to storm them with kiblasts or something else disapears because you see him stand up and dont know if he has energy to swoop or anyhting.

In the series if they had "negative ki" -I have no more energis- They layed down like scat and watched how someone else fighted
 
New Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2002
Messages
561
Best answers
0
I edited this post down... this is just to show you a scenario of using neg-ki to its fullest extent and how to justify what you get for using neg-ki to win struggles.


Someone block struggles a huge power attack. They decide to push their all into it and go massively into neg-ki debt. They win the struggle, they kill 5 players with the huge explosion. The players spawn back instantly ready to go kick that persons arse...
Note that the guy that shot the beam would either:
1. have a vastly superior PL to force this player into neg-ki to win the struggle and decided that they did not want the bad effects of neg-ki to win the struggle OR
2. has a similar/lower PL and went into neg-ki himself and lost the struggle anyway

Now, the blocking guy has just caned his arse to the max. He is knocked out on the floor for a few secs (say 3 secs... i hate knock outs in games so i make this quick). He comes to (wakes up) and stands up but can hardly walk (100-75% neg-ki). You have to press your ki recharge button now... the negative ki fills up MUCH slower than what normal ki recharging does. So you have to stand there for about 3-4 secs charging ki to be able to run around again (about 75-50% neg-ki range) - you still cant teleport or fly. Keep charging for another 2-3 secs you can fly again (50-25% neg-ki. How far into neg-ki could affect your speed). Charge up your ki again for about 1-2 secs you can now teleport and you are now at "zero" ki level. Charge for another 4-5 secs and you will fill your real ki pool again.

There's 13-17 secs where your player is vunerable (ie: has not got maximum ki pool as the least worst problem).

Now... you try and dodge 5 players that just got beam raped by you in the middle of a server for 13-17 seconds with no Ki alone this is currently impossible.

dont try and tell me you can just go hide off somewhere and recharge while these people hunt you down like a pack of wolves for 15 seconds. You can hardly MOVE let alone run off and hide in a corner to recharge.

The negative effects of neg-ki balances the positives it gives.



I can see the next complaints "15 seconds! that way too long!" and thats the exact point. Push your character to that much of the limits and you deserve the 15 seconds recharge time. You got the 5 frags for it after all didnt you?

I can see your point: you got 5 frags and then the 5 players come kill you. thats 5-1 in your favour. Yes. But you got that from an extreme block struggle. I don't know about your version of ESF, but in mine when I win a block struggle the ki attack just shoots off in the opposite direction. I dont get to aim it towards a pack of unsuspecting meleeing players. If you don't notice someone struggling with a huge beam for a half a minute and didnt notice that beam would be deflected straight towards you ... YOU DESERVED TO DIE.
 
New Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Messages
109
Best answers
0
Yes, i can aim where i return the non beam or beam :p


And besides, if you are playing team, generaly if all the other team comes to kill your team wont stay smoking a ciggar, unfortuntately virtual ciggar does not exist yet so they will go and look for enemies, and they see them there and not here, so what am i doing here when i can swoop and get a free melle because they are distracted on the guy!

-You are not alone in the game, you can get help-

If you are going to die against the wall, turn on turbo, you will win the struggle, and get a chance to live! THIS MAKES NON BEAMS MUCH MUCH MUCH WEAKER

Ki is already something to look out if you dont want to end up normal while being on ssj or several other things.

I see no other advantages than comodity! Everyone thinks how they could fight their struggles better and they dont think the other one will have that chance too!


And you may need just 3 seconds to recover instead of 15

GOD the beauty of this game is that if you dont you dont need to wait the round to finish! Deaths are not DOOM!

AND there are still lots of ideas you didint answered
 
New Member
Joined
May 7, 2003
Messages
291
Best answers
0
think its a good idea :)

but to add alittle more realism you can make to them go negative for umm.......lets say 5 secs and after that your HP starts 2 drop.
 
New Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Messages
109
Best answers
0
:no: :no: :no:

Nobody reads my trheads!? This idea sux!! ;( ;(
 
New Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2002
Messages
561
Best answers
0
yedi: i can see your point. if everyone has negative ki then they will all use it. so it would cancel each other out.

i think it is an ok idea, because it puts more into the powerstruggling. but i think v1.2 is already putting some new things into PS and this system might be a lot of coding, despite how many people like it... i just like the idea of having bigger and better PS. I think an anger or limit break bar could provide the same sort of functionality to this, with less re-coding expense and offer more alternative features by means of it (the limit break bar).

But this has been one of the better ideas I've seen for "pushing yourself to the limit" in struggles etc. that's why i think it is a good idea. Not so much that it MUST be put in, just that it is one of the best ideas for implementing this feature I've seen.
 
New Member
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Messages
109
Best answers
0
Well catfish, you cant detonate them so if they start heading to nowhere you are stuck untill they reach a wall...

Only catfish reads my posts?
 
New Member
Joined
Jun 23, 2003
Messages
440
Best answers
0
i like the idea but i see problems in it that have been covered by oter ESF players :]
 
New Member
Joined
Feb 17, 2002
Messages
561
Best answers
0
That is not essentially a problem with this idea Yedi, that is more a general power struggling bug. And I think they are trying to prevent that already in v1.2 release.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top