My Complete Re-Balance Idea.

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Alright After you guys read what I have to say just let me know what you think then support your opinion please. This is my first big topic, so I want things to be...Simple ;) Ok, Like the title of this Thread states, this will be the statement on what "I think" would be best for balancing the esf game. Don't take into consideration if the ideas I post take too long to develop, just say what you think of it initially. And I won't try to post ideas already on the 1.3 outline (hopefully!) because this is going to be long enough as is. ALRIGHT lets get started! In order of how Units appear on the selection screen...

Buu- This Character is in my opinion, overpowered. Huge amounts of HP, high damage beams, candy beam which can heal hps/ki-raise PL-do BOTH, and a self regen skill all make this character a one man powerhouse that can take a licking and keep on ticking. My suggestions on him would be lower hp slightly like 10-20 and take away the manual healing skill and make it innate (auto regen) but at a slower pace, like instead of 1 hp per .75 seconds make it 1 hp per three to four seconds. Candy beam shouldn't necassarily HEAL his hps (due to innate regen), but raise PL and heal Ki mainly. Generic beam is fine. Mouth Blast is fine but charge faster and do slightly LESS damage. (isn't it stronger than Kamehameha? Anyways make it as powerful as Kamehameha) In ESF 1.3 he should also start with, thats right, START with Vanishing Ball (Evil version of Spirit Bomb) at Form 1, but a weak version of the attack, but as he transforms it can become bigger and stronger. Also have it move about as fast if not slower than Spirit Bomb, but have a slight Tractor beam effect on it, which helps "pull players" along with it like it did with Gohan in the series, but doesn't explode on impact but rather it causes damage much like a Ki Blob would, and where blocking the attack and failing would cause it to detonate like usual beams/bombs/etc. Other than this, these are my ideas for Buu...

Goku- I feel Goku doesn't have the potential he should have. Starting off, he's rather puny compared to the massive Buu's PL, so he should be given about a 300k PL boost to help him out. Ok, skills lets see. His Gen Beam is fine as is. Kamehameha drains way too much Ki for what it is as is, so I think it should drain less ki, and keep damage as is. Also allow it to be released at secondary as a Kamehameha Ball (would be neat to see :)). Spirit Bomb takes a little long to charge for being so easy to dodge, I mean cmon, a swoop completely gets you to safety, so lets make it either a LOT bigger or really, really fast. Damage is fine as is. Teleporting for Goku should be a skill, and be able to "drop a charge" to teleport back to. One Ally within Melee distance is able to be dragged along as well, but limited to a 15-second cooldown to not encourage spamming. Kaioken should hopefully be implemented (with a charge bar to indicate what level (ex. full = KaiokenX5)) but with slow hp drain (according to Kaioken level) so to promote dramatic, longer battles. Kame Torpedo's are fine, but limit to 2 :). Should gain a passive "Heroic Inspiration" when hps are under 30%, where stats raise temporarily until death. Everything else is fine.

Gohan- My opinion is this is the weakest of the Z warriors. However, early transformation helps a bit so I'll try to be quick with this. Generic beam is fine. Shield Attack is way too weak, should drain alot more Ki, and deflect lasers at an angle. Attacks absorbed will drain ki at a set % (like Gen beams drain 5% ki, and ult's drain 40% ki). Kamehameha is fine, but being he only gets it at SSJ it should be renamed Super Kamehameha, allowed to be used only under 25% of hps, have NO CHARGE TIME, Drain all remaining Ki when used but leave in SSJ form until beam detonates, deal damage equal to amount of Ki drained at time of usage, have beam be larger around and resemble that of the Final Flash beam graphic and have cooldown of 1-minute. May sound cheap but ppl under 25% of hps are usually being bombarded with Blasts and beams and wont live long otherwise as Gohan. Masenko is fine as is, but secondary should be a blast, not a beam, which has great homing capabilities. Should gain Rage skill, which can only be used under 10% hps and when used allows a random 5-8 seconds of slight Hp/Ki-regen with a 1-minute cooldown. Everything else is fine.

Krillin- Being right next to Gohan as one of the weakest characters, I feel he needs numerous tinkers. First, raise his speed a set +15 at the start and leave it that way. No speed gain at transformation. Generic Beam is fine as is. Destructo Disk should be Uber fast, but where if you see him charging it you have enough time to swoop away, but moving normally would get you killed :devgrin: . Kamehameha is fine for him. "Scattering Ball?" (forgot name) should be instant, use full Ki bar, and have a cooldown of 1-minute. Should gain Passive "Heroic Inspiration" just like Goku when under 30% hps. The rest is fine.

Piccolo- Is a Decent character that needs a number of improvements. First off, HE needs the manual regen skill, NOT BUU! Except, make it heal 25% hps and use 50% Ki with 1 minute cooldown. Generic beam is fine. Special Beam Cannon should ONLY be an attached beam. Moves as fast as the new Krillin Disk, allow it to kill instantly, but also to be used on beam struggles as well. It should have almost no splash damage, as it doesnt Explode but it pierces its target. Blocking it damages PL temporarily as it was intended during the show (would exhaust the foe slightly, I think Cell or Evil Buu used it on someone to show this effect?). Scatter Shot should be limited to 8 and stick to a fixed radius of *20 ft.* and each Scattershot would cumatively make the enemy move -slower- due to the disorient of looking around at them unless he teleports away from them (50 ft?), at which time they disperse. Secondary fire causes them to lock on and explode, causing a cumalative "Ki blob" explosion which gets bigger per shot, but disperses quickly. Once Secondary is fired, if a shot hits then the enemy becomes Immobile until the end of the onslaught. Masenko should be like gohans. Eye Lasers should be removed since I've only seen him use it once or twice. his true Ultimate would be Split form, when he speeds at the enemy Ultra quickly and if the enemy doesnt block, Piccolo would engage in an extremely draining, difficult to dodge, and potent "Melee". 4x the attacks should be available during the attack, and dodging them would require extremely fast reaction times. Everything else is fine.

Frieza- Ah. My dear Mr. Frieza. What to say about you? NOT ENOUGH GOOD SKILLS! First off, Telekenisis is too useless, weak even at the highest of PLs, and should be turned into a totally different type of telekenisis. What I have in mind is this, a Cooldown skill, which after 2-minutes, you pull an enemy to you and can release (like a throw but instantly with no Ki cost) for pretty decent dmg like 20-25. Generic beam should be stronger as its the only beam he has...and should be renamed Death Wave. At Form 1 its the same as Generic beam and at form 2 and after it becomes an area-of-effect beam with increasing effectiveness as forms progress. Finger Laser is fine as is, its deadly in the hands of a sniper. Death Ball should be made to match Goku's Spirit bomb, and should float high above his head as well. And Frieza Disk should move a little less than my krillins new destructo disk. Thats about all for him.

Trunks-Trunks is an ok Melee character but other skills are lacking. Needs Surprise attack (instant beam with a 45-second cooldown that lowers Ki of a target enemy) Generic beam is ok, Burning attack should be as strong as Gohans masenko, maybe less as much because it can blind, and Finishing Buster is fine. Sword should replace normal melee (takes it out when melee is selected) and deal more damage than other characters using melee. Rest is ok.

Vegeta-The Prideful vegeta! Prince of all sayajins! starting stats should be equal to his rival, Goku. Needs a revamped Gallick Gun, should be as strong as kamehameha, Big Bang needs to be instant with a good drain on Ki, and Final flash should take a little less charge time and less KI. His Renzoku should have homing capabilities and explode like weaker versions of generic beam. He should get "Saiyajins Pride", a passive skill which makes him faster and stronger until under 60% hps (at which time his pride starts getting fed to him in handfuls hehe). Rest is ok at the moment.

Cell- Needs a few stat adjustments, like 5-10 more hps. Give Absorption with tail which steals PL temporarily with a 90-second cooldown. Have a less potent version of Buu's new innate healing (like 1 per 7 seconds). Allow all the attacks he has to be the same except be a little less effective since he isnt experienced at using them like the others. Thats about it.

Thats about all for now, Im going to sleep right now so just write me comments and opionions and I will update this soon. Thanks! Any other suggestions would be great also.
 
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nice ideas, i like the ones about buu but I don't think goku needs to changed that much, nor does vegeta
 
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your ideas try to relate to much to the show, but are bad for gameplay reasons. And I hate cool downs. It works better in rpg's but not fast paced games like esf, and can hold back player skills. Just lower beam damage, and its all fair.
 
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tonythetiger123 said:
your ideas try to relate to much to the show, but are bad for gameplay reasons. And I hate cool downs. It works better in rpg's but not fast paced games like esf, and can hold back player skills. Just lower beam damage, and its all fair.
I have to agree with you there.

Goku is already overpowered as is, kame torpedos, khh & kame torpedos plus the addition of being able to teleport while charging attacks when super saiyan (esf's take on instant transmission).

As for Buu, seeing how people can use him and seeing as hjow he has the edge over most other characters at the start, for him to have another attack would be unfair seeing as he is already faster then everyone else & has more hp and a higher starting pl. Mouth blast is enough, her shouldn't start with vanishing ball, it should be an attack he gets when he transforms as it gives a player something to work for too (not a trasformation by itself, but the attacks that come with it).
 
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Allivan said:
Alright After you guys read what I have to say just let me know what you think then support your opinion please. This is my first big topic, so I want things to be...Simple ;) Ok, Like the title of this Thread states, this will be the statement on what "I think" would be best for balancing the esf game. Don't take into consideration if the ideas I post take too long to develop, just say what you think of it initially. And I won't try to post ideas already on the 1.3 outline (hopefully!) because this is going to be long enough as is. ALRIGHT lets get started! In order of how Units appear on the selection screen...

Buu- This Character is in my opinion, overpowered. Huge amounts of HP, high damage beams, candy beam which can heal hps/ki-raise PL-do BOTH, and a self regen skill all make this character a one man powerhouse that can take a licking and keep on ticking. My suggestions on him would be lower hp slightly like 10-20 and take away the manual healing skill and make it innate (auto regen) but at a slower pace, like instead of 1 hp per .75 seconds make it 1 hp per three to four seconds. Candy beam shouldn't necassarily HEAL his hps (due to innate regen), but raise PL and heal Ki mainly. Generic beam is fine. Mouth Blast is fine but charge faster and do slightly LESS damage. (isn't it stronger than Kamehameha? Anyways make it as powerful as Kamehameha) In ESF 1.3 he should also start with, thats right, START with Vanishing Ball (Evil version of Spirit Bomb) at Form 1, but a weak version of the attack, but as he transforms it can become bigger and stronger. Have it move about as fast if not slower than Spirit Bomb, but have a slight Tractor beam effect on it, which helps "pull players" along with it like it did with Gohan in the series, but doesn't explode on impact but rather it causes damage much like a Ki Blob would, and where blocking the attack and failing would cause it to detonate like usual beams/bombs/etc. Other than this, these are my ideas for Buu...

Goku- I feel Goku doesn't have the potential he should have. Starting off, he's rather puny compared to the massive Buu's PL, so he should be given about a 300k PL boost to help him out. Speed-wise he's slow too so +10 speed would also be nice. And +10 hps because for some reason he is abnormally durable during the series and seems to fight almost endlessly. Ok, skills lets see. His Gen Beam is fine as is. Kamehameha drains way too much Ki for as is, so it should drain less ki, and keep damage as is. Also allow it to be released at secondary as a Kamehameha Ball (would be neat to see :)). Spirit Bomb takes a little long to charge for being so easy to dodge, I mean cmon, a swoop completely gets you to safety, so lets make it either a LOT bigger or really, really fast. Damage is fine as is. Teleporting for Goku should be a skill, and be able to "drop a charge" to teleport back to. One Ally within Melee distance is able to be dragged along as well, but limited to a cooldown to not encourage spamming. Kaioken should hopefully be implemented (with a charge bar to indicate what level (ex. full = KaiokenX5)) but with slow hp drain (according to Kaioken level) so to promote dramatic, longer battles. Kame Torpedo's are fine, but limit to 2 :). Should gain a passive "Heroic Inspiration" when hps are under 30%, where stats raise temporarily until death. Everything else is fine.

Gohan- My opinion is this is the weakest of the Z warriors. However, early transformation helps a bit so I'll try to be quick with this. Generic beam is fine. Shield Attack is way too weak, should drain alot more Ki, and deflect lasers at an angle. Attacks absorbed will drain ki at a set % (not figured yet, Im tired and will update this later). Kamehameha is fine, but being he only gets it at SSJ it should be named Super Kamehameha, allowed to be used only under 25% of hps, have NO CHARGE TIME, Drain all Ki but leave in SSJ form until beam detonates, deal damage equal to amount of Ki drained at time of usage, be larger around and resemble that of Final Flash Graphic and have cooldown of 1-minute. May sound cheap but ppl under 25% of hps are usually being bombarded with Blasts and beams and wont live long otherwise as Gohan. Masenko is fine as is, but secondary should be a blast, not a beam, which has great homing capabilities. Should gain Rage skill, which when used allows a random 5-8 seconds of slight Hp/Ki-regen with a 1-minute cooldown. Everything else is fine.

Krillin- Being right next to Gohan as one of the weakest characters, I feel he needs numerous tinkers. First, raise his speed a set +15 at the start and leave it that way. No speed gain at transformation. Generic Beam is fine as is. Destructo Disk should be Uber fast, but where if you see him charging it you have enough time to swoop away, but moving normally would get you killed :devgrin: . Kamehameha is fine for him. "Scattering Ball?" (forgot name) should be instant, use all Ki, and have a cooldown of 1-minute. Should gain Passive "Heroic Inspiration" just like Goku when under 30% hps. The rest is fine.

Piccolo- Is a Decent character that needs a number of improvements. First off, HE needs the manual regen skill, NOT BUU! Except, make it heal 25% hps and use 50% Ki with 1 minute cooldown. Generic beam is fine. Special Beam Cannon should ONLY be an attached beam. Allow it to kill instantly, but also to be used on beam struggles as well. It should have almost no splash damage, as it doesnt Explode but it pierces its target. Blocking it damages PL temporarily as it was intended during the show (would exhaust the foe slightly, I think Cell or Evil Buu used it on someone to show this effect?). Scatter Shot should be limited to 8 and stick to a fixed radius of *20 ft.* and each Scattershot would cumatively make the enemy move -slower- due to the disorient of looking around at them unless he teleports away from them (50 ft?), at which time they disperse. Secondary fire causes them to lock on and explode, causing a cumalative "Ki blob" explosion which gets bigger per shot, but disperses quickly. Once Secondary is fired, if a shot hits then the enemy becomes Immobile until the end of the onslaught. Masenko is good. Everything else is fine.

Frieza- Ah. My dear Mr. Frieza. What to say about you? NOT ENOUGH GOOD SKILLS! First off, Telekenisis is too useless, weak even at the highest of PLs, and should be turned into a totally different type of telekenisis. What I have in mind is this, a Cooldown skill, which after 2-minutes, you pull an enemy to you and can release (like a throw but instantly with no Ki cost) for pretty decent dmg like 20-25. Generic beam should be stronger as its the only beam he has...and should be renamed Death Wave. At Form 1 its a beam and after that it becomes an area-of-effect beam with increasing effectiveness as forms progress. Death Ball should be made to match Goku's Spirit bomb, and should float high above his head as well. And Frieza Disk should move a little less than krillins new destructo disk. Thats about all for him.

Trunks-Trunks is an ok Melee character but other skills are lacking. Needs Surprise attack (instant attack with 1-minute cooldown that drains Ki from target enemy) Generic beam is ok, Burning attack should be as strong as masenko, maybe less as much, and Finishing buster is fine. Rest is ok.

Vegeta-The Prideful vegeta! Prince of all sayajins! starting stats should be equal to his rival, Goku. Needs a revamped Gallick Gun, should be as strong as kamehameha, Big Bang needs to be instant with a good drain on Ki, and Final flash should take a little less charge time and less KI. Should get "Saiyajins Pride" a passive skill which makes him faster and stronger until under 60% hps (at which time his pride starts getting fed to him in handfuls hehe). Rest is ok at the moment. (tired) O_O

Cell-And Cell. Needs a few adjustments, like all Attacks should be less Ki drain, more charge (not used to them) and Passive regen like buu. More Details after sleep.

Thats about all for now, Im going to sleep right now so just write me comments and opionions and I will update this soon. Thanks!
I shall try to analyze and give my thoughts on these suggestions.

Buu: It is true that he is overpowered especially mouthblast but it does not need a faster charge thats just plain ridiculous. Also it should be toned down alot more then it is. Right now its up there with Final Flash.

Also he should not get vanishing ball until Kid Buu its the only time he ever used it as Kid Buu so that should remain how it is.

Goku: To say that Goku isnt up to his potential and slow o_O is far from accurate. Trunks, Krillin, Gohan, Frieza, and Piccolo are slow. Goku is one of the fatest at the start actually. Also take into consideration that he can teleport with any beam (should be toned down with a cooldown or somthing) and he has kame torpedos in a sense kame balls like u requested.

Hes far from not reaching his potential if u ask me. Hes the most currently used character on esf for a reason:scared:. Anything else would be overkill.

Gohan: True he is one of the weakest but his early trans makes up for it considering after trans youll probably run the server at the beginning and also be the fastest. Ill agree shield needs changing doesnt nearly provide enough protection and also the shield attack is also pretty weak to say the least.

Krillin: At the start he is one of the weakest characters long trans time slow etc etc. But after trans u can basically run the server. Very fast and scatter beam can kill everyone in the server. If any ideas for him need to be made is that he should be buddied with 18 and made faster of course. Maybe also some new attacks.

Piccolo: Is an ok caracter if u can use him properly like Ravendust said b4 Piccolo jus needs to be a powerhouse for 1.3. Eye laser needs to be stronger. Needs Makosen. Maybe 2 transes instead of one. And light Grenade.

Frieza: Lets see telekeneisis is being changed for 1.3 he will be able to smack people wit buses etc etc. Needs that uh i forget the name its like a earth cutter attack or somthin needs to be instant tho. His generic should not be stronger cus he doesnt have a beam. Frieza is an instant attack character except for deathball. That is his strength.

Trunks: (Here it comes :laff:) No Trunks melee is not okay. Yes he is supposed to be the melee chracter but i see no difference in melee that sets him apart from the rest. In 1.1 there was the sword but it was taken out on this one.

If anything his sword should be put back in and since he is the melee character he should have a melee advantage others dont. Maybe his basic melee hits do more damage then everyone elses and instantly gib if hit with low hp like 1.1. Also i think Trunks finish buster/buster cannon should have two forms.

Left mouse does the real finish buster (big beam that killed cell in his time) and the right mouse should do buster cannon. Burning attack should be a ball instead but i heard they wer doin that already so......last but not least if ur gonna crown someone THE melee character then they shouldnt be one of the slowest on the game.

Vegeta: I agree gallit gun should be stronger then it is now considering it was infact stronger then kamehameha. Big bang should stay as it is and Final Flash should stay as it is. I think vegeta should get Atmoic Blast wen he reaches ssj2 as well.

Cell: I dont think regen would work for him. People would just run away wen theyre health gets low and let their health regen. I honestly dont see anything wrong with Cell but for an extra attack i think cell should maybe get to form cell juniors that can only be used once per life that like scatterbeam would get after every person thats not on ur team but they should be like little bots or somthing that do nuttin but melee but die in like 1-2 hits and that attack can only be used once per life.

There done. I didnt bother to go over the whole "Saiyan Pride" abilities and others as i really dont see a need for em. (jus my opinion tho) But there u have it.
 
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But Gakit Gun is already as strong as teh Kamehameha. It deals teh same damage. It just reaches its maximum faster. Basicly if you charge the GG and the KHH ingame the same amount of time they are equal.
 
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O_O Since when??? Everytime i go into a ps wit gallit gun and someone does a Kame AND we are at equal strength i always get overpowered with ease. And i dont run out of ki either. Kame has an advantage over gallit gun for sure.
 
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here is my balance idee's :
Buu: it's good the way it ismaybe just 1 000 000 pl on his normal form ,and he will have his one attacks like Body part attack and genocyd, and as for the fanishing ball he culd eat a frieza and get a death ball
Goku: it's all ready over power speed ,strong attacks,strong beams,teleport whith beams , i think the stamina will balance Goku
Gohan:it's good the way he is fast trans , it's good and on his SSJ2 he will be verry powerfull and verry fast so i think he dose not need any thing more
Kurilin:kurilin has big speed but his a hard trans caracter so it's beter to be like theath he just need's some attack like multidisk attack ,goku right click spirit bomb and this is it
Fireza: well frieza it's goig to be a great caracter he will have it all many trans, instant attack (just a small sugestion fireza right click attack on laser suld be easy to block and many laser on right click )
Picolo:Well Picolo to balance Picolo will be hard ,i say and keep my sugestion ,whith his cape on he suld be able to gaine more pl in fighting,whith out his cape pm 1x5 he will be whith half as stong but, and maybe a life increse like,from 120 to 140 and no cape from 140 to 160, and picolo need a increse of speed normal 180 ,and no cape from 250 to 270
Trunks:well trunks has a verry fast transi think he will have a fast USSJ to
he will only need a increse of speed, normal 180 ,SSJ from 250 to 280 like all SSJ speed
Vegeta:I think the GalletGun will get stong but will you move whith it ??i think they r going to make the galletgun to not move whith it like evry Vegetas strong beams so if your a beam spamer it will be hard not to get killd by your one attack (but still I will like for Vegeta's Gallegun to move whith it)
Cell:My dear Cell he will have speed , life , permanet transformations, all attack and maybe add Finger laser(he killd trunks whith finger laser)
A18/A17:I think they will have combine attacks, i don;t know the speed but i think it will be as big as the SSJ , they will defenetly have a PS advantaj
Gynu:He will problably have a big pl i think 1 000 000 the hp of 120 , budys,buddy change i think he will be a interesting caracter
A19/A20:They suld be add it agains beam spamer they will have a 4 attack a ki drain ,agains beam spames he shot a final flash A20 jups and get the beam he will get like 100 000 pl or if you like the pl the beam spamer put in the beam
 
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Absolutely great idea. With you 100%. If the impliment this they should give you some credit :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: :yes:
 

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So you want to take EVM and tweak it a bit.

No thanks
 
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Thanks Phoenix, and John no offense but I agree with nge, Tweaking EVM isn't what I had in mind.. I just wanted a new way to play the existing game in a fun and wonderful way. tonythetiger123, Only reason why I ask for Cooldowns is so the attacks aren't spammed over and over again. The wonderful attacks should be used at spectacular and decisive moments. For ex. my Frieza Telekenisis tweak. No cooldown would = grab-slam-grab-slam-death. Not really fair -_- And yes these tweaks would make the game more angled toward the series as they didnt use thier most powerful attacks over and over, but I doubt putting a 1-minute cooldown on Gohans Super Kamehameha would make gameplay poor, it would just make players conserve the ultimate skills until the last moment :p Updating my original post btw with the rest of the tweaks..
 
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well i did not say anything about EVM ,EVM sux my ideeas r pure ESF
 
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Well yea you're right John, you didnt say anything about EVM, just looked a little like what they used when you first posted it. Oh well :p No big deal. You have nice ideas also but try not to get overbalanced.
 
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like tony said... cool down time is useless in esf. like lets say u have a 75 sec cool down in one of the attacks.. u will die like 5++ times or something by the time u can use it again o_O and i agree more with dark trunks version >.>
 
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Yugi_Yami said:
like tony said... cool down time is useless in esf. like lets say u have a 75 sec cool down in one of the attacks.. u will die like 5++ times or something by the time u can use it again o_O and i agree more with dark trunks version >.>
Well you wont necassarily die that many times because all the other attacks aren't actually changing, just addon moves that you would sparingly use once in a while. I think everyone here can agree that just because you fire off an ult doesn't mean you dont have other attacks to back you up. The ults are for last second desperation attempts, I merely posted them as attacks of opportunity. Who wants to see Krillin spam Scatterbeams everywhere? lol I dont. Hehe just because an F-16 pilot fires all his missiles off doesn't mean his guns are out of bullets ;) (if you see my comparison :p)
 
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Allivan said:
just because an F-16 pilot fires all his missiles off doesn't mean his guns are out of bullets ;) (if you see my comparison :p)
Fighting games and airplane games cant be compared, two completely different genres.
 
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tonythetiger123 said:
Fighting games and airplane games cant be compared, two completely different genres.
If i'm not mistaken, when you fly an F-16 and you fire bullets, aren't you, um, you know, fighting?
 
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Fire Phoenix said:
If i'm not mistaken, when you fly an F-16 and you fire bullets, aren't you, um, you know, fighting?
With that logic, strategizing inside the c0ckpit on how "you are going to kill the opponent" doesnt make the airplane game a stategy game. Firing bullets inside an airplane doesn't relate to the fighting game genres.
 
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You can't compare ESF to a fighting game, either. Street Fighter isn't ESF, nor is Mortal Kombat, nor is Primal Rage. ESF is closer to flying an F-16 than it is to a fighting game. Why? Because you're actually flying, and manuevering in much the same way that you would in a fighter.

Trying to outsmart your enemy in an online combat flight simulator requires as much or more strategy than the hardest "strategy game" you can imagine. If you think controlling a squadron of fighters doesn't involve strategy, you should probably end it. Just end it. You know what I mean.
 
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lol where u been zeo

That still doesn't make an airplane game defined as a strategy based game (RTS), even with strategy involved. Counter-strike has strategy in it during matches, but its still an FPS.

Actually I consider esf to be a 1st/3rd person fighting game.
 

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