ESF is.. (Not) Dead

[Mastasurf]

Look.

It has been a very tough year for ESF. We have been faced with multiple server moves, kids thinking that it would be funny to break into our forum/site, WoW, and many of the team members moving onto college, jobs, girlfriends, fiancés, and wives that require more of their time. I should probably add a lack of support from the community to the list too since these "esf is dead" threads seem to be so popular.

It is true that we may not have always chosen the path for ESF, but we are experimenting and learning through trial and error. If it weren't for trial and error simple things like the swoop wouldn't even exist. Everyone would be stuck playing some rip off of another game or mod. Budokai half-life edition anyone?

It isn't like anything is being hidden from you guys. We are very open with our design process and have made an effort to post our documents on the forum. On top of that we are in open beta. You can play what we are testing. What more do you want? Play the open beta; read the design documents; give us feedback. Believe it or not the feedback posted on the forum (if constructive) does make it into our team discussions. Thank you everyone that has posted bugs and feedback in the past. It helps.

Despite taking all of the blows mentioned at the beginning of the post the core ESF team has pushed on. Updates are being made whether you can see them or not. A lot of the changes have been made to the internal systems.

The movement system will be changing. A few ideas have been agreed on by the team and once the design documents are complete they will be posted in the forum for review. I think that we have nailed the swoop and simple melee down.

A lot of our time has been dedicated to discussing game play and making energy attacks more useful (split disc, box crosshair, etc). Our goal is to have players use melee and beam attacks an equal amount of the time. The focus was first placed on improving beams, but more recently we have shifted back to fixing melee. KongKong has taken the initiative to compile a list of melee features based on community member feedback. Hopefully all these contributions will help fix the issues with melee.

A group of us still actively work on the mod. Just as an example, Pcjoe, Darktooth, and I have been holding "sweatshops" on Sunday's. This is where we all pile into a room and work on ESF all day. That isn't something developers would do for a dead mod.

For those of you that think ESF is dead. That’s fine. I can’t tell you what to think, but keep it to yourself. We don’t need you beating down what little moral is left. If you really cared about the community or the mod you would be more supportive.

...It is rare that a development team is dedicated enough to work on a free modification this long.


-Quick Status Update-

- Our cvs/rsync server took a dive so new open beta versions and inteam test versions will be on hold until a new server is up.
- In short, the forum is ****ed. We are running on a corrupted database right now and we will either need to start fresh or restore and older backup. A poll will be setup so you guys can give input.
- Filefront has moved us to a new server which can handle our traffic load better.
- harSens recently had an accident and hasn’t been able to program due to an elbow injury
- A new website design is in the works. A newer CMS will be put in place which should make posting updates easier.

 

[Jakut]

Guess the last dead thread was the straw that broke the camels back eh Masta ?

Anyway, nice clarifying post for the non-believers.

 

[Spunky]

Yeah, and tell harSens that he can still program with one hand.

 

[Synth]

Yeah, and tell harSens that he can still program with one hand.

A little insincere aren't we?

 

[Spunky]

A little insincere aren't we?

It's a joke...

 

[Synth]

It's a joke...

NO, IT CAN'T BE A JOKE!!!1

I MUST GIVE YOU A WARNING!!!1

 

[Mr.Lukyas]

so masta made it official, huh?
I say don't give up. Fight back, destroy WoW, destroy RTSs!1!!!!!1oneone!jedanjedan!!!einein!!!11unouno!!!

 

[Morphan]

why dont you just start over with a fresh forum, iv never gived up on ESF its still the best Dragonballz mod out there, i often look for updates on the forum/website i dont belive esf is dead, and i hope it will never best of luck to you developers

 

[Skyrider]

- In short, the forum is ****ed. We are running on a corrupted database right now and we will either need to start fresh or restore and older backup. A poll will be setup so you guys can give input.

It is not totally corrupted. Aside from a few users deleted from the forums, I haven't seen any problems.

 

[DaRkOwNs]

For those of you that think ESF is dead. That’s fine. I can’t tell you what to think, but keep it to yourself. We don’t need you beating down what little moral is left. If you really cared about the community or the mod you would be more supportive.

yeah, if we really cared about the community we would have a constant active role. oh! wait a sec! we have!

look, its no offense personally but we dont hear from even ONE of you for months at a time. their is still no actual melee (which hopefully after talking to kong you guys have started working on) and there are alot of things those of us who have stuck with the mod want changed that no one will listen too.

as ive said countless times, i really do understand the jobs/commitments you guys have but i have mostly the same. job, school, girlfriends, family, christmas is a *****, and school. twice for emphasis. even through all that i can still get on for an hour too play.

A lot of our time has been dedicated to discussing game play and making energy attacks more useful (split disc, box crosshair, etc). Our goal is to have players use melee and beam attacks an equal amount of the time. The focus was first placed on improving beams, but more recently we have shifted back to fixing melee. KongKong has taken the initiative to compile a list of melee features based on community member feedback. Hopefully all these contributions will help fix the issues with melee

thats actually good too hear, but as a word of advice. dont be afraid to make the drastic changes you guys have been terrified to make in the past. this is the last version and im gonna hope it be the best, if released.

 

[Chakra-X]

yeah, if we really cared about the community we would have a constant active role. oh! wait a sec! we have!

There are many of us that are like that, but you can't ignore the overwhelming amount of negative feedback, nonconstructive, pessimistic, and hateful projections many people seem to have. I myself though ESF was hanging by a thread. Dead? No, but just getting by. I don't find myself testing 1.3 or playing 1.2 because computer games are beginning to lose my interest somewhat. Ashame I have to say "I'll wait for 1.3" and let other find the bugs.

But, the title of this thread confuses me. It says ESF is dead, but your post looks like it's trying to prove otherwise. I know what it's like to have people hanging on to my next piece of work. The flash movies that I showed this forum were done for free, on my spare time, when I felt like it. When you take the amount of time it takes to make something like a movie, let a lone a game, I personally would release it whenever I felt it was ready.

Maybe you do find yourself with a lot of time now and then. But, why force yourself to channel your energy in to a free game that has a shaky active fanbase? I admit 1.3 has taken much longer than I'd expect, but what am I going to say? "Work faster"?

It's frustrating for the community, at varying degrees. But I think we can deal with it. I know when I was finishing the last part of my trilogy, and people would wine "You said it'd be out a week ago!!" or "You gave up didn't you!" or "When it coming out???! HURRY!!!"

Honestly, they weren't entitled to anything. And while ESF has had strong community additions which makes ESF a part of theres, I see where you are coming from, and I'd be a hypocrite to criticize your pace.

 

[Zeonix]

No one is saying ESF is dead because 1.3 isn't going anywhere. We're saying ESF as it exists now is dead. Just take a look at the forum population and then take a look at the number of servers and the number of people who play this game. Many of you seem to refuse to want to wake up to the fact that ESF is, in fact, dead, and now it's entirely in the team's hands to create 1.3 in such a way that old players and new players alike will flock to it. This has nothing to do with being negative and everything to do with walking around with your eyes open. We're not counting the number of people who are playing 1.3 in the future. We're counting the number of people who play 1.2 and test 1.3 now.

Even now we're being kept in the dark about what's going on. Imkongkong is just saying "We talked to a bunch of people. **** is happening." If we ask him for specific details, "Uh...Yeah, I'll ask Mastaturf if I can tell you." What's the big secret? Why aren't we in the circle of trust yet? Why do we need to beg for information? Just tell us what you intend to change and how, and we'll give you feedback. Isn't that better than keeping everything a secret, implementing the system, and then finding out everyone hates it...again?

Why are we so negative? Because of our experiences dealing with you guys. As Dark said, you post maybe once every few months, if even that often. Are we supposed to just forget everything that's happened since 1.2's release and follow you guys on blind faith?

We're still here, and we're still waiting and hoping that 1.3 isn't going to be 1.2 all over again. That's plenty of support right there. Give us something to work with and I'm sure plenty of people will be happy to commend you on how awesome whatever feature you implement is. You have plenty of cheerleaders on this forum. The rest of us want to see results.

 

[imkongkong]

masta wants me to make a document of all the changes to post, but we wont be finished deciding till our next meeting

 

[Zeonix]

Ramen to that!

 

[Sicron]

Either way, I think I speak for everyone if I say, that it has been one hell of a ride, and ESF is something to be proud of. Few teams have managed to keep a mod alive for this long, and do it as good as you guys have done. If ESF would die out after all, I would really like to know if you guys might have any other projects on your mind, because I know that each and every one of them would be amazing.

 

[DarktoothDKD]

As Masta has stated, PCjoe, Masta, and I have been having ESF sweatshops where we work on the mod all day. I would wake up at 2am, goto work and come home at 12 noon, then stay up till 10pm or so just to work on the mod. And a lot gets done in those hours, its ridiculous at the talent we have in our team. There ARE going to be a lot of changes in ESF for the better. It will be much more fun in every aspect.

Not to mention, we got a few more toys to play with in the character development department Im sure all you mod-modders will LOVE to have.

 

[Killface]

Either way, I think I speak for everyone if I say, that it has been one hell of a ride, and ESF is something to be proud of. Few teams have managed to keep a mod alive for this long, and do it as good as you guys have done. If ESF would die out after all, I would really like to know if you guys might have any other projects on your mind, because I know that each and every one of them would be amazing.

Yeah, I completely agree with that. I never seen a Mod stay alive like this before, and i have gratitude to the people who are working on it.

 

[Pcjoe]

EDIT: Wow.. My forum account is all messed up...

Yeah, the last few years have been a bit long... Like Andrew (Mastasurf) said, we've all been pretty busy with life. When ESF started out I was in Middle/High School, and had more free time than what I knew what to do with. Now I'm constantly either working full time or attending college. [Insert more **** about being busy here, blah blah...]

With that out of the way, we ARE actively working on the mod. Granted, it's not close to the same speed as before, but we're all trying to come together and push this release out the window. It's to the point where we can't just be like "**** it" since so much work went into it, but there's still a decent amount of stuff left... Unless something drastic happens like one of our core team members quit, ESF will keep on pushing through.

So... I've been putting a whorish amount of effort into client side stuff. I really hate posting work that's incomplete, but I'll make a small exception for this post....

This is the particle editor that will be used to build nifty effects in ESF; it utilizes the custom widget/window system I've built via VGUI. The 3D preview window will contain the particle system you're working on (rendered in real time). You'll be able to easily attach particle systems to map entities, models (including specific attachments/bones), use it with the fx script system, and a lot of other cool things. Expect to see the full version on the main page sometime in the near future.

WORK IN PROGRESS

WORK IN PROGRESS

Personally, I really can't blame you guys for thinking ESF is dead. We pop in like once in a blue moon, and then fail to update the main page for who knows how long... Things have been a bit hectic, especially with all of the web server moves. Hopefully we'll be posting some new stuff on the front page in the near future to revive some of your faith

 

[VideoJinx]

Interesting stuff =]!!, but don't forget to constantly check/critique my "In Progress" thread


http://esforces.com/forum/showthread.php?t=71794

 

[sub]

Stop pimping your stuff Jinx