Esf 1.21 tweaks and reasons?

[NightShade]

Well i can understand ki ball spam but...


Basic melee dmg. I not only one thinking it did not needed tone down. Basic melee is what makes esf fun for alot of people. Adv melee has to many risk to use. Even with the added protection and speeding up. It still not worth it when you got a big blast waiting for you.


Beam jumping. People use this as a escape to get away and beam spam some more. I am sure sonic said something about it. But a ki increase?


Now that blocking is kinda better. We are going to see more block counters that was taking out of 1.0

I might be wrong about some of it. I just really did not understand the need to make basic weaker. Making people try and use adv more would do more harm then good to gameplay when adv melee is just to slow for alot of peoples taste when they had 1.0 and 1.1. Just my 2 cents flame away.


I sure some of this will get address later on and this was a bug fix patch. I just telling what some peeps dont like.

 

[Snow]

I agree with you there, but esf is now n00b friendly, and i guess n00bs cant be bother to learn how to tele and hit. So esf made is easy for them.

 

[Sonic the Vampire]

1.2.1 is harder for new players than 1.2 was... everyone loves jumping on the popular-theories bandwagon don't they? Advanced melee is faster, there's no longer an exploit, and simple melee knocks people back a little faster and a little farther so there's less room for error in linking hits.

The damage was reduced from 10 to 7, along with ki blasts. So what? It isn't the end of the world. The problem before was -> You have 2 million PL and I have 1 million. Two simple melee hits would do 40 damage to me, three ki blasts would do 60 damage. That's 100 damage. Now it's moderately less. At even PLs two hits and three ki blasts still does 35 damage (used to do 50), assuming you don't knock them into a wall. Just hit them a few more times.

I didn't notice anything about beam jumping, but it isn't like you're supposed to ride the beam across the map, so I don't see why that's an issue.

The advanced melee block "counter" was in 1.2 . Just learn to use it and learn to avoid it. It isn't as instant as the 1.0 counter. New people wont be able to avoid it so it'll frustrate them but more experienced users who know how to teleport after they deliver a hit shouldn't have a problem.

 

[guncon123]

i like the 1.0 1.1 days whare u had to have skillz to even try to take sumone on... aww like the 5 - 6 hit combos!

 

[NightShade]

Well the problem i see is. Turbo plus a small beam jump=being thrown a far enough away to be able to charge a sbc or kame. So thats the major issue i see with beam jumping because beams hurt like hell even with block.


I can see your point about the dmg. Yet then again with pl being fixed issues like that would happen far less.

The block counter. Well sometimes you really dont have time to teleport away. even if you do. It all depends on the ki edge. Person standing still blocking is using less ki then the person who charges blocks then teleports away. The blocking person having the more ki can just keep charging until they force the person to charge and get a hit. Plus people who are fast enough aka ping and other factors sometimes dodging is not a option. If the person blocks you going get adv melee in your face.

 

[Lethal_Vegetto]

I like how people cant be spectator anymore
I hate when there was allways a player being spectator. Pissed me off so much. Im just reading it from what has been done in the patch, i havent played it yet, heh. Just hte part about cant be spectator player anymore cought my eye.

 

[Ultima2_freeze]

DO what now? Skill? did u just say 1.0-1.1 was the "having to have skill to take someone on days" ....... dude u had a friggin aimbot melee system are you even kidding me? It was pure swoop,tele,charge,swoop,tele,charge, on and on. I'm looking for the skill.

in 1.2 there is a wider variety of "tactics'... and i defy a non 'skilled' player to go up against those that are truely 'skilled' in 1.2... and tell me that u dont have to have skill to take on anyone in 1.2.... that's the biggest load of bull i've ever seen. Play a real opponent, then talk.

^^ THis is not a statement on which is more 'fun' to you.. because that's your own opinion. But when it comes down to what takes more 'skill'... you're horribly mistaken.

 

[NightShade]

yo dont change the subject about skill and crap. I was just asking a question about tweaks. then you guys go on about 1.0 wtf

 

[sub]

I like the majority of the tweaks they made in the patch. The swoop seems to respond a little better then it did before. It looks like they changed the hit detection so that its harder to hit people. They toned down basic melee a little, it really needed to be toned down. I don't think them toning basic melee down will force people to use advance melee though, basic melee is still a lot better adv. melee. About the block thing, I haven't seen anyone blocking in the patch yet so I can't say anything about that.

The only things I don't like other then the random crashings is beam jumping and the simple melee combos. For beam jumping, instead of it eating more ki, it should have been toned down speedwise. For the melee combos, it's still way too easy to do them. I was kind of hopeing it would be made more of a challenge. Oh well, overall the patch is better then regular 1.2.

 

[Carnage the 1]

The beamjumping is indeed annoying tho not impossible to win speedwise, I've had many ppl that try to bjump their way out of the battle, most of em didn't get very far.

Imo, the biggest problem in 1.2.x is speed. 1.1 was one hell of a fast paced game, if you had the skill of course. I know that me and lynx (no he doesn't hack) had some pretty intense battles wich made us sweat buckets of water. I have yet to experience that in 1.2. I'm not saying 1.2 sux, but I believe that most of the veterans prefer speed and "skill" over advanced melee. Wich is just, dodge the arrows. At that point I don't feel like im actually doing something, wow im pressing directional keys, how exciting. In the previous versions, if you made a mistake you got knocked all over the place, perhaps not n00b friendly, but it was fun even if you lost. You actually had the feeling you were "stronger" than the other if you had beaten him over and over. Alot of the clanwars were lotta fun, now, you have to wait because someone is pressing arrows again so you put a beam in his mouth the second he get's out, wow that's skill.

Pulling of a 3 to 6 hit combo is much better looking than a few dodges and girly hits. A possible solution would be that "simple melee" would be same as 1.1 and no more teleport delay, wich is something that, in my eyes, is completely useless in the first place anyway. In the show, they didn't have a delay, and gameplay issues? none, we've had 1.0 and 1.1 and once you got used to it, there was no problem. That way, you can use the old melee and once in a while throw advanced melee in for the special combos or to finish them.

Swooping? No problem, beta 1.1 was fine so is 1.2, its a diffrent system but in my view it actually does something usefull, in 1.1 it was all about the aim, of course it still is but with a bit more depth. I can imagine the team making the swooping slower, but why do that now? There aren't any new transformations yet are they? You can change those speeds in 1.3, by doing it in 1.2 it only makes the game slower than it already is.

Conclusion: 1.2 is slower and probably better for the newcommers. I asume that in 1.3 your speed is faster but with this melee system the gameplay still is slow. If I recall correctly there was a thread that said that 1.2 was all about the melee and that 1.1 melee was only a part of the new melee. Is that true? not really, it got so modified everyone can pull those combos off.

In 1.1 it was harder to do but you got rewarded with satisfaction, you could even do that same moves to create a combo. But now... now you can do 2 hits max and thats it, then you can spam kiblasts. In 1.1 it required timing, wich came naturally as you played more, yet now with only one teleport or simple swoop you can get a free hit. That is not the way I pictured advanced melee, I don't know who's idea it was to change it so drastically but imo, it was a bad idea.

Of course this is just my opinion and others may think diffrently, but I have been a loyal esfer since beta 1.0 and I'd like it to stay that way. I am not against new ideas as long as they benefit all players, but now I feel like me and some other players have been forgotten.
In the end, it's all up to the team and I know that they will not neglect people's opinions. The mod is great no matter what changes but keep an eye that it's not going down hill.

 

[Sonic the Vampire]

I wont address everything...

1.) Beam jumping was already addressed by the team. I suggested the speed and radius be reduced and it will be in 1.3 (or if enough of you complain maybe in 1.2.2).

2.) With PL gain "fixed" it sorta puts the better players at even more of an advantage, but it allows the less experienced players to transform faster.

3.) If the block counter is being used on you over and over try throwing some advanced melee in every once in a while. It'll drain their ki (although it will take more of yours) while you prepunch and perhaps you can get in a few hits with the new increased advanced melee speed.

@Ultima-> Don't bring up skill. You'll start a debate no one can win. Skill is whatever you believe it to be.

@Carnage-> Slower isn't always horrible. The speeds are fine once you get used to them, it's just easier to hit each other. You can still move plenty quick if you use dropping and teleporting and all that in melee. Once you transform the speed improves quite a bit as well. I really don't see speed going back up before 1.3 at this point, you'll just have to adapt. I'd also tell you to get into some serious one-on-ones and then take another look at the two-hit simple melee thing. No, it's not as difficult to do as it was in 1.1 (it's about 500x easier), but there's thinking involved on both sides. When do you try to recover/let yourself go/chase after to get in the second hit/w/e. There's more to it than it looks. In 1.1 the odds of scoring even a double hit were very low in one-on-one because of all the speed involved. Odds were you'd hit your opponent at some bizaare angle where they'd fly off in a direction you weren't ready to teleport towards.

 

[SaiyanPrideXIX]

They made basic weaker because everyone and their mother hits you twice with it. That was obviously not an intention of the design of the game.

Any other complaints are irrelevant to me until I play it, but that one speaks for itself.

 

[Phatslugga]

I personally like the patch with the exception of the crashing of course. Adv.melee is a lot faster, and using light attacks is worth the effort.

 

[Zeonix]

They made basic weaker because everyone and their mother hits you twice with it. That was obviously not an intention of the design of the game.

Any other complaints are irrelevant to me until I play it, but that one speaks for itself.

I believe Boyster himself said that the 2 hit and a ki blast was purposely designed that way. If it wasnt, im sure they wouldnt have made it easier to do in the patch now that you dont teleport past your opponent.

 

[Hibiki]

I believe Boyster himself said that the 2 hit and a ki blast was purposely designed that way. If it wasnt, im sure they wouldnt have made it easier to do in the patch now that you dont teleport past your opponent.

its not intentionaly designed to be whored like some people do

orginaly there was no limit what so ever on the simple melee hit but when u could kill someone with no effort and no retaliation a cap was put on it

 

[sub]

its not intentionaly designed to be whored like some people do

orginaly there was no limit what so ever on the simple melee hit but when u could kill someone with no effort and no retaliation a cap was put on it

Not intentionaly designed to be whored? Hmm... OH I KNOW I KNOW!!!!1!! WE CAN PUT A DELAY ON IT!!!111!1!!

 

[imkongkong]

basic melee should not be weaker.. instead the ki costs to perform it should be MORE.. basic melee is a very hard hit, thus will need more energy or ki to perform it

 

[sub]

Imkongkong, thats a horrible idea. Take this into account. In 1.2, the swooping speed was not only made slower, but the cost of ki that the swoop uses up increased. So your going at slower speeds for using more ki... I never have any ki in 1.2. I would seriously just quit if they made the simple melee hit require more ki. It would just be utterly retarted anyway to implement that considering the adv. melee requires no ki to do around 5 trillion punches and kicks.

 

[imkongkong]

in simple melee you send them flying.. if you ever played legends, regular attacks up close would take a little ki.. when you would do the chain hits, each hard hit would take up a chunk of your ki

think about it...

weak hits (advanced melee)= lesser energy or ki = small damage

medium hits (advanced melee)= reg energy or ki = reg damage

hard hits (advanced melee)= more energy or ki = more damage

hard hits that send you flying (simple melee) = much more energy or ki = much more damage

 

[MysticUub]

in 1.2 there is a wider variety of "tactics'... and i defy a non 'skilled' player to go up against those that are truely 'skilled' in 1.2... and tell me that u dont have to have skill to take on anyone in 1.2.... that's the biggest load of bull i've ever seen. Play a real opponent, then talk.

aaaand what is it that the 'skilled' players use?...simple melee...that came from 1.0 and 1.1...cause to be good at adv melee all u need is a good knowlege of the keyboard and the hand eye coordination of a three year old...and i have played 'real' opponents...not one of them used adv melee..

and about the whole spectator fight thing...what is everyones problem with that?....i mean its not a big deal that its been taken out...but how can u complain about it?...its just like having 3 teams...theres no advantage to being a spectator..especially if u are the only one doing it...cause then u have an entire server to fight and the other teams only have one extra person...it doesnt give u any advantage power wise...or speed wise...its acctually a disadvantage most of the time...so y complain about it?...