Character/s Suggestions: Android 19 & 20

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Hey,
I had a pretty kool character suggestion for either ESF 1.2.3 or 1.3.

My idea as you can imagine was to add both Android 19 & 20 with there various attacks from the show.

Android 19 & 20
Stats:
Starting PL: 2,000,000 (weaker than 17 & 18 but stronger than Goku or Vegeta)
Attacks:
Photon Wave (Budokai Game) plus the normal generic beam and so forth.

Energy Absorption:
Then you give them a new ability, where by there guard is infact an energy absorption. Where by if a person preforms any form of generic beam or other beam, if 19 or 20 block the beam they gain the cost of the beam onto there own energy bar.
However if they are at full or it exceeds there energy life bar they then start to gain PL by X amount.

Not sure if that is possible, as i don't know if a basic move can function as a defense against melee and also be a form of absorption (i.e. energy).

Tell me what you think or if it is possible?? :p
 
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How do you know they aren't already in the game? :)
 
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Sky stop teasing the fanbase >.<
 
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It's possible but the problem is other than absorbing ki, they have no attacks whatsoever. This kinda kills them as characters, they'd be interesting but only as one-trick ponies.
 
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I think it would be better and more interesting if they would have a fixed amount of energy they can absorb
 
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Your right, but i suppose you could add new moves, like the Eye Laser or possibly make up new attacks?

But when i think about it, Android 18 only has 2 attacks max in 1.2.3, and she isn't totally useless.

I was thinking that you would emphasize the absorption ability, make that be the only real reason to use them. It does make opponents think about whether they would use energy attacks in-game, especially if they know its potentially going to be absorbed and help someone else rather than kill them.

Yeah Sky stop teasing me... :p
 
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Correction 1.2.3 doesnt have A18 thats ECX and im not sure if shes in by default or not.

In any case having the 3 main androids is more than enough if you considder that they are tag teaming with the buddy system.
 
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I think she was...??

I am guessing that the buddy system is like the Ginyu Force in open beta?? Where they can change in and out, and more of them become available the higher ur PL.

Why not add them into the already existing buddy system of A16, 17, & 18?? this is presuming it is those 3 androids??, or even just 1 of them (me personally i prefer A19 :p). However you still would be making them, so it wouldn't cut down alot of time, but it is one way you could put them in without technically have 5 Androids on the character selection.

How can you resist a fat white marshmallow looking Android, tag teamed with an evil Android scientist? :p
 
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Easy. Giving the androids 5 buddies would overpower them. Even with 3 their ability to not be seen on the radar gives them an advantage.

I already forsee it that the buddy characters will be the strongest in the game XD
 
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Fair enough. Perhaps at a later stage they might be added in to a version, as they are quite different to 16, 17 & 18, in my opinion. :)

Is the Ginyu Force and the Androids similar in there Buddy System or different?? Like the Ginyu force have 2 in at once??
 
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Well, if you count the Ginyu team it would be like.... 5
Cpt. Ginyu, Burter, Recoome, Jeice, Guldo.
I think 5 androids will not disrupt the balance (unless if they would be really powerful :) )
 
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The androids main weapon is that they can not be detected by the radar. They are invisible to it.

That and the buddy system itself is powerfull as it extends one characters HP to that of multiple characters.

As you and your buddies HP are different. So for example if your main character is about to die, you switch to the buddy and you have a full HP bar again.
 
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But couldn't that be counteracted by making the overall HP equal that of a single character?

For example (hypothetically), lets say Goku has 600HP, and you have 5 Androids 16-20, in order make it even so that Goku isn't outmatched by 5 characters each with 300Hp, you make it so that each Android has a the HP that totals to 600 or there abouts. (I.e. 16: 140, 17&18: 130, 19 & 20: 100= A total of 600HP).

If you have ever played Super Smash Bros Brawl, there are 3 characters each with a similar buddy system but slightly different. Poke Trainer, Zelda & Shiek, and Ice Climbers.

So you could do something similar to what they did. Like wear you have the ginyu force has two out at once (which u already do have) and have there hp not total a set about, but they can die no matter what member/s ur using.

while you could have the Androids not being detected on radar, but have a set amount HP they all equal in total, and when one dies the next one in line swaps in (example: 16->17->18->19->20->16), so if 16 dies you swap over to 17 and so forth. Or if you have already swapped to say 20 and he dies you immediatly go to the next one who hasn't died.

In short what iam suggesting is in order for a player to get 1 kill on the Androids they must kill all 5, but in order to get 1 kill on the ginyu force they only have to have one member die. However each has a different advantage to the other (as stated above), but both have a buddy system that allows them to swap in and out mid-game.

It doesn't sound balanced, when i put it like that. But when you have each individual ginyu force member with more than 140 health, and each Android with no more than 140, it works out.
 
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Fair enough. Perhaps at a later stage they might be added in to a version, as they are quite different to 16, 17 & 18, in my opinion. :)

Is the Ginyu Force and the Androids similar in there Buddy System or different?? Like the Ginyu force have 2 in at once??
By the way.. Please do tell me that each character will have it's unique fighting style... :(
 
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Do remember that the buddy system is a transformation system. Meaning you must unlock the budies. Before you can use them. So giving the main buddy character less HP than any of the other character normal forms would put him at a huge dissadvantage. And killing him is as follows.

If a buddy is out and you kill him, he immediately switches to the buddy. If no buddy is out, he dies, and if you kill both him and the buddy at the same time, he dies.

There can only be 1 buddy active at one time. But you are still a 2 man character so to say ^^
 
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Ok, kool :)

But i am still a little confused.
Cause your sorta contradicting yourself.
You say 3 Androids are stronger than the 5 Ginyu force members. But 5 ginyu force members are stronger as they have more buddies. Which one is it??

How does the Ginyu Force function with 5 members and not over power 3 Androids?? (Besides the Androids have there stealth) It doesn't make sense... :S. Considering that 5 buddies is essentially stronger than 3.

So to put more buddies on a Buddy character such as the Androids would unbalance the characters, and make them overpowered? But you already have a 5 buddy character, the Ginyu Force.

So how does a 5 buddy character not beat a 3 buddy character or a single?? See if i have all the ginyu force buddies available, and i am using say Ginyu with Recoome out. You essentially have to kill Ginyu plus the 4 other members. Where as you have the 3 buddy androids, you only have to kill the main android plus the 2 others. This means that you have to kill 3 Androids in total compared to 5 ginyu force members.

So in all sense you should either be decreasing the Ginyu Force's strength or increasing all other characters to match that of the Ginyu Force. As they are the ones who are actually overpowered. As stealth in a online game with 4 or more people won't be that advantageous, your guaranteed to be found by at least 2 people, that's if your fighting, if not then no you won't be found, but you won't be doing any harm either.

Not to mention A19 & 20 earn a position just as much as Guldo, Burter, Jeice or Recoome, as a buddy character. If you go off their role as a villian or character in the series, they were the main villians for 3 or more episodes. While each of the ginyu force members mentioned before would have had a combined number of episodes of about 5-8 as the main villian, inter-mixed with frieza.

No offense Grega, but in all honesty i think its a cop out on your part.
 
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The problem with 19 and 20 is that they don't offer anything other than absorbing ki. The Ginyu force had their own unique attacks, especially Ginyu meaning that they aren't just gimmick characters.

The Stealth the Androids have make them far less predictable, it's tough to see what they're doing. This gives them a clear advantage. Don't worry about the Ginyu force. Ginyu should be the most powerful of them, once he's dead it's a massive blow to the team. Of course you could choose a buddy but they're not quite the same. The Androids were relatively similar in power to each other in DBZ, making the loss of one less damaging.
 
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As a side note. Try turning off your scouter when fighting someone and see how much harder he is to keep track of XD

Thats essentially what the androids are.

And as Doku said. With the ginyu force, yes you have the 600 HP Ginyu, but his lackeys dont reach over 200 HP, while with the androids they have more HP and they also get more starting PL than Gunyus lackeys. Its far easier to kill off one of Ginyus buddies than it is to do the same to the androids. That and adding 19 and 20 would be like doing a Goku buddied with Goku character. They are equal and have only generic attacks, where the other androids have more unique attacks. Not to mention your idea of absorbtion would end up making their block useless for them since they would either succeed or get blown up on the go. Where if normally blocking you still have a chance to win.

But if we want to get them closer to DBZ, then they wouldnt be consuming KI, but PL. They sapped the strength of the people, which in DBZ coresponds to KI, stamina and even health.
 
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All the more reason to make them a buddy character to the others, even if its just 1 of them.

The fact that they are a gimmick gives people all the more reason to want to play them, because they offer something different. How many esf games have allowed players to change bodies with their oppoents or absorb ki? None so far. :)

Like Ginyu's body change, its a different move, changing bodies with an opponent would be fun and creates a twist, people don't expect it and will most likely use Ginyu just for that move.

Same goes for Absorbing ki, its different, creates a twist, people will use them for that ability.

Even better yet look at 1.2.3, 30 or something different characters, even though people didn't play most of them when it came to online play. As Vegeta & Goku were overpowered, People still liked the fact they all existed, for the mere sense of i can choose this character if i want too.

I bet you that if you asked people who there real favorite character is, it wouldn't be either Vegeta or Goku, it would be the underrated character like Yamcha or Pikkon. And most probably only played goku or vegeta because they were overpowered and considered winning more important than having fun.

If i knew how to do it, i would create them myself, lol. :p

---------- Double Post below was added at - 01:17 AM has been merged with this post created - 12:51 AM at ----------

Sorry but i am just not convinced that just because the 3 androids have stealth is a sufficient reason not to include 1 of them.

Yes it may be difficult with stealth, but it's definitely not a reason, just an excuse.

But they don't have to use just generic attacks, as i stated in the my very first post.

Both had there own moves: There eye laser and Photon Blast (Budokai games). You add in a life drain move: player has to be a certain distance from the player, acts like a grab, drains the opponent of life & ki the longer you hold them. That makes up 3 very different moves to the other androids. Even make him weaker than the others, which they r in the show.

So how is that different to someone like Broly who had his omega blaster and a move similar to the big bang attack. 2 moves aside from the generic ones.
Or Bardock, Burter (Purple Flash attack), Jeice (purple flash attack)

All i am really asking is that you consider at least Android 19 as a candidate for a forth buddy. I can't make you put him in, only ask or request and provide reasons why he should be included.
 
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All the more reason to make them a buddy character to the others, even if its just 1 of them.

The fact that they are a gimmick gives people all the more reason to want to play them, because they offer something different. How many esf games have allowed players to change bodies with their oppoents or absorb ki? None so far. :)

Like Ginyu's body change, its a different move, changing bodies with an opponent would be fun and creates a twist, people don't expect it and will most likely use Ginyu just for that move.

Same goes for Absorbing ki, its different, creates a twist, people will use them for that ability.

Even better yet look at 1.2.3, 30 or something different characters, even though people didn't play most of them when it came to online play. As Vegeta & Goku were overpowered, People still liked the fact they all existed, for the mere sense of i can choose this character if i want too.

I bet you that if you asked people who there real favorite character is, it wouldn't be either Vegeta or Goku, it would be the underrated character like Yamcha or Pikkon. And most probably only played goku or vegeta because they were overpowered and considered winning more important than having fun.

If i knew how to do it, i would create them myself, lol. :p

---------- Double Post below was added at - 01:17 AM has been merged with this post created - 12:51 AM at ----------

Sorry but i am just not convinced that just because the 3 androids have stealth is a sufficient reason not to include 1 of them.

Yes it may be difficult with stealth, but it's definitely not a reason, just an excuse.

But they don't have to use just generic attacks, as i stated in the my very first post.

Both had there own moves: There eye laser and Photon Blast (Budokai games). You add in a life drain move: player has to be a certain distance from the player, acts like a grab, drains the opponent of life & ki the longer you hold them. That makes up 3 very different moves to the other androids. Even make him weaker than the others, which they r in the show.

So how is that different to someone like Broly who had his omega blaster and a move similar to the big bang attack. 2 moves aside from the generic ones.
Or Bardock, Burter (Purple Flash attack), Jeice (purple flash attack)

All i am really asking is that you consider at least Android 19 as a candidate for a forth buddy. I can't make you put him in, only ask or request and provide reasons why he should be included.
Excuse = Reason.

Also, I think that the ESF team will do their best at this.
Leave the game to them. If your suggestion is not accepted.. Just live with it :)
 

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