Want Adv. Melee to be Harder? I got you covered...

SaiyanPrideXIX · Jun 18, 2004

A while back deep in some thread, Pain made a suggestion that the sprites for the melee arrows be changed so that they ALL look like random arrows with the appropriate directions lit up. Thus, they all look similar and it makes them harder to keep track of.

My random arrows have also been changed to be simple question marks; making it trickier to guess them because they don't look like arrows themselves and thus confuse you a bit more because they aren't actual symbols and don't flow naturally with the other arrows.

I'm at work right now so I can't put the pack up, but when I get home tonight I'm probably going to post it. But I wanted to ask if there'd be an interest in it here? After all...you would be downloading something that makes the game harder. I dunno how well that's gonna go over.

TehMuffinMan · Jun 18, 2004

umm yep... this really will make it harder.. but it kinda isnt right, ya? you gotta guess while your opponents gonna get em all right..kinda takes off a might edge, if everyone replaced there sprites, it'd be different since its even for everyone and its harder to block attacks =)

PRJ · Jun 18, 2004

Maybe the higher PL you have, the more Random directions for the other player who doesnt have that much PL

?
Could be that the Random Direction could apear more for the ones with lower players that makes it more true that the strongest can read the oponents attacks better :O
(shouldnt this be in suggestion thread O_@)

SaiyanPrideXIX · Jun 18, 2004

Oh no, man. You don't guess. They aren't all randoms...let me explain.

The arrows are now all pictures of the cross thingy that we'd only normally see when you get a random. But the relevant direction is lit up on the four-way arrow.

Crude drawing for better explanation (ignore the periods):

.../\...
<....> = Normal Random that we have now.
...\/...

.../\...
<....> = One of my arrows representing that you need to press Up
...\/...

.../\...
<...|> = One of my arrows representing that you need to press Diagonal up-right
...\/...

So a string of my new arrows might look like this:

../\......../\......./\......../\......../\..
<....>....<...|>...<....> ...<...|>....<...|>
..\/........\/.......\/........\/........\/..

Hopefully you get it better now. Wow, what a lame combo, huh? lol You can still defend yourself but it makes it trickier because all the arrows look similar.

Pain · Jun 18, 2004

heh, hopefully the team picks it up so it wont be only a select few people ^_^

and yea the original thread was here

http://forum.esforces.com/showthread.php?t=43819&page=3

Pain said:
ok so about those random arrows.... right now how it works is, theres always a certain chance you will get a random arrow. but without these randoms everything is too easy to block right? ive been trying to think of a solution to random arrow thing... and an idea ive been toying around with is this:
every arrow is the random arrow shape. however, depending on the strength of the attack and etc, the shade of the correct direction will show up more. so for instance, if you do a light hit downward - your opponent will see a multidirectional arrow but with a bright higlight on the downward spike. the longer it stays on the screen, the less it shines (like now, if it stays for too long it fades to a random)

so what about the strong hits that you dont want your opponent to see?
well EVERY hit is going to be random, the only differance is going to be the length and brightness of the correct direction.

therefore, if you make a strong hit downwards, your opponent will see a multidirectional arrow, with a slight hightlight downward. it will fade away quickly and will be hard to see, but it is there.

this idea could use a lot of tweaking, and as i said its just something ive been toying around with. but basically as i said, depending on the strength of the attack you will have different highlights and highlight length.

as for diagonals, on the random arrow there are no diagonal sides, so the hightlight would appear on both of the directions of the random (IE: left and up)

if this is tweaked i believe it would require people to actualy pay attention and react quickly instead of blocking everything put in front of them and guessing at randoms... because really... anyway you spin it.. it IS guessing...

*edit*
heh well i guess i should have posted this into the suggestion forums... but *shrug

TrueShot · Jun 18, 2004

i like that a lot makes the game more challengeing cause ive been in games where i almost never got hit in adv. melee cause it was so easy to push the buttons i vote yes

SaiyanPrideXIX · Jun 18, 2004

I actually had to test them on my game and I'm not that good, so I suck now at blocking advanced melee. I got hit by the combos like 9 times my first game back...embarassing. lol

PRJ · Jun 18, 2004

SaiyanPrideXIX said:
Oh no, man. You don't guess. They aren't all randoms...let me explain.

The arrows are now all pictures of the cross thingy that we'd only normally see when you get a random. But the relevant direction is lit up on the four-way arrow.

Crude drawing for better explanation (ignore the periods):

.../\...
<....> = Normal Random that we have now.
...\/...

.../\...
<....> = One of my arrows representing that you need to press Up
...\/...

.../\...
<...|> = One of my arrows representing that you need to press Diagonal up-right
...\/...

So a string of my new arrows might look like this:

../\......../\......./\......../\......../\..
<....>....<...|>...<....> ...<...|>....<...|>
..\/........\/.......\/........\/........\/..

Hopefully you get it better now. Wow, what a lame combo, huh? lol You can still defend yourself but it makes it trickier because all the arrows look similar.

Oh,i see nice Idea!
(if this will be in ill be pwnz00rz again :devgrin: )

Sonic the Vampire · Jun 18, 2004

Considering your eyes are always focused on the arrows when you're hitting directions it'd only take maybe twenty minutes to adjust to the new arrows, so I'm not sure that's the best solution. The arrows are already similar shapes if you aren't looking directly at them so it wouldn't be a real stretch would it? I think we're working on making different arrows for kicks and punches, which would require more concentration as it is.

SaiyanPrideXIX · Jun 18, 2004

Oh well, I actually neglected to mention that this was strictly a temporary solution.

The thing that makes the human eye focus on an arrow is its point. So when the arrows are just single directions, you don't even look at the arrows, you see where the points end. From there it's a matter of hand/eye coordination. I tried to make these ones sort of subtle, just for the sake of being confusing in a tight situation.

If nothing else, I find that I screw up blocking a decent percentage more often with them (and I overwrote my old ones like a dumbass. lol)

MysticUub · Jun 18, 2004

id dl it...if it were gonna effect everyone...but im not gonna put myself at a disadvantage...

SaiyanPrideXIX · Jun 18, 2004

Weren't you one of the people saying how stupid advanced melee was because it was so easy to block in the other thread where Pain originally made this suggestion???

MysticUub · Jun 18, 2004

uhh...yea...but like i said im not gonna put myself at a disadvantage...i can block just about every adv melee attack sent at me (with the exception of a random here and there)..and thats my point...y should i give that up when the other person isnt?

ChÃ© · Jun 18, 2004

uhh...yea...but like i said im not gonna put myself at a disadvantage...i can block just about every adv melee attack sent at me (with the exception of a random here and there)..and thats my point...y should i give that up when the other person isnt?

Because if you wont, then the next person wont either,
Like a revolution the first people have to sacrifice so the main stream opens their eyes.
The way I see it you say your all tough, but you cant handle a small handicap.
Which brings me to the next part, It really wont be that much harder im afraid.
And in the long run, youll have people calling eachother anti-handicapper or w/e because they defend right.

However I really like what you are doing, and I respect you for it.
Once my pc is formatted(dont have esf now) I will install it for the heck of it.
Me support is with you all the way.
take care

Phatslugga · Jun 18, 2004

Did I miss a download link? I'd like to give it a shot, sounds like a great idea, and hopefully it'll become official.

RaVe · Jun 19, 2004

Hmm....interesting idea here.

I might give it a shot. Might even put up the sprites for download if I do get the time to upload them.

DarktoothDKD · Jun 19, 2004

damn.. nice arrow thing you got there

hmm.. random directions.. well.. the ESF team just wanted to keep it from being a guessing game.. but if you guys want it that way.. have fun

Pain · Jun 19, 2004

and please take into consideration my idea about doing away with all the randoms and using the "quicker fade" instead.

it would eliminate any and all guessing if you are actually paying attention.

Mondy · Jun 19, 2004

I would download them as i do want to try them out should make the game a bit more fun

SPIDER-BITE · Jun 19, 2004

i too think the advanced melee should be a little more skilled, but making it even more based on luck wont accomplish this.

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