Regarding melee

[Ryokeen]

So then as you agreed there will be the situation where you will die by the next hit. Where is the difference then between a noob killing you and a Pro ?
For me it's not about fairness, it's about that some skilled players(Hlev you're kinda the only one here who wants that) can't take that a noob might be in the right place at the right time to give you the final hit. Even a hp regain system won't change anything at that point because , one will allways end up in that situation.

So the only thing it does is, that event happens later, not less, just later. And getting killed beause you're low on HP isn't near any punishment, if it is for you..get better. Same thing around i could say, Don't punish noobs because they are noobs and don't award skilled players even more just because they are skilled players.

And if you're so concerned about skillfull players should have a chance to prevent that hit...well that my friend is called skill

 

[hleV]

So then as you agreed there will be the situation where you will die by the next hit.

If a skilled player wasn't skilled enough to be prepared for any chance of anyone getting a lucky hit on him, then so be it, it means death.

 

[vector]

If a skilled player wasn't skilled enough to be prepared for any chance of anyone getting a lucky hit on him, then so be it, it means death.

your definition of "luck" is actually ... just you getting hit. don't see how its considered a lucky hit. you got hit bro (a hit is a hit)

 

[Enishi]

hleV's system benefits mostly pro and good players, bad thing is that pro players really enjoy noob ass-kicking. Gap between pro player and newbie is so huge that newbie thinks pro player is cheater and after 40 deaths in a row he will quit...

 

[hleV]

hleV's system benefits mostly pro and good players

Which ESF feature doesn't?

 

[pumadace2000]

hleV's system benefits mostly pro and good players, bad thing is that pro players really enjoy noob ass-kicking. Gap between pro player and newbie is so huge that newbie thinks pro player is cheater and after 40 deaths in a row he will quit...

That's what he fundamentally doesn't get. He knows that ESF features mostly already benefits pros. From his reply you can see that he clearly knows that his system benefits the pros. What he fails to get is the fact that ESF needs neither more features that benefit pros, nor systems that cater only to noobs. It's fine as it is. He can make all the drama in the world about how "doomed" the poor pros are from the very beginning until the very end. I am glad it's all a waste of energy for him since 2 people on the dev team have already said no, or do I count 3? (that was a reference)

But hell he can fight the luck factor and be Don Quixote all he wants, or play X and O where there's no such thing as luck.

 

[Nebulisreconx]

Question is. What fundamental dynamic of life does not benefit someone who is more skilled in dealing with it than another? There is no luck, no good or bad, only our interpretations of how they do or do not benefit us.

I say if a noob chooses his moment for whatever point and hits you, it's not luck that made him act. He is just as capable seeing opportunity like anyone else, and he choose to act. That's understanding the situation, becoming skillful learning what works and does not work.

The only lucky hit is if you see him coming and move out of the way and he happens to ACCIDENTALLY move the same way and still hit you. But if for any other reason you get hit, it's not luck. That's skill in development, development that for most noobs may take as long as this mod is!

 

[pumadace2000]

Question is. What fundamental dynamic of life does not benefit someone who is more skilled in dealing with it than another? There is no luck, no good or bad, only our interpretations of how they do or do not benefit us.

I say if a noob chooses his moment for whatever point and hits you, it's not luck that made him act. He is just as capable seeing opportunity like anyone else, and he choose to act. That's understanding the situation, becoming skillful learning what works and does not work.

The only lucky hit is if you see him coming and move out of the way and he happens to ACCIDENTALLY move the same way and still hit you. But if for any other reason you get hit, it's not luck. That's skill in development, development that for most noobs may take as long as this mod is!

Well he also called certain issues such as connectivity issues or lag spikes hitting at the wrong time as luck, but those can hit both ways and no amount of healing will solve the fact that some people have bad ping on internet connections.

 

[hleV]

What you don't get is the fact that pros are punished for a one-time thing. A noob may get a hit, yes. He will get rewarded for this by PL. But why would a pro be punished by death for getting hit by a noob only if that one-time hit happens to be when the pro is of low health? That death is as undeserved as it gets in a skill-based game and if there's a way to avoid such nonsense, it should be done. Every feature rewards skilled players more. My suggested feature does not punish noobs (because kills don't count towards victory).

If your concern is noobs not being able to get lucky and undeserved kills against skilled players, then I suggest you figure out what a skill-based game is.

 

[pumadace2000]

What you don't get is the fact that pros are punished for a one-time thing. A noob may get a hit, yes. He will get rewarded for this by PL. But why would a pro be punished by death for getting hit by a noob only if that one-time hit happens to be when the pro is of low health? That death is as undeserved as it gets in a skill-based game and if there's a way to avoid such nonsense, it should be done. Every feature rewards skilled players more. My suggested feature does not punish noobs (because kills don't count towards victory).

If your concern is noobs not being able to get lucky and undeserved kills against skilled players, then I suggest you figure out what a skill-based game is.

If kills don't count towards victory then why is the death of a pro a punishment?

 

[hleV]

Because according to the scoreboard the pro is of lesser skill and the noob is of higher skill than they actually are. If via death one loses PL (not confirmed), then it's even more so a punishment for the player who died undeservedly.

 

[vector]

Because according to the scoreboard the pro is of lesser skill and the noob is of higher skill than they actually are. If via death one loses PL (not confirmed), then it's even more so a punishment for the player who died undeservedly.

so your entire concept of punishment is based on something ur presuming/assuming. You say pro is being punished .... but there is no punishment, just a reward for the noob. you say they are getting lucky hits ... but ur definition of lucky hit is a well timed hit at an opportune moment.



and here i have the definition of a retard

characterized by a slowness or limitation in intellectual understanding and awareness,

 

[pumadace2000]

Because according to the scoreboard the pro is of lesser skill and the noob is of higher skill than they actually are. If via death one loses PL (not confirmed), then it's even more so a punishment for the player who died undeservedly.

But you said this.

My suggested feature does not punish noobs (because kills don't count towards victory).

So if kills don't count towards victory, meaning they mean nothing to the scoreboard, like you said, then why is the pro, according to the scoreboard, of lesser skill than a noob.

Also would you care to explain how does someone who has had let's say hypothetically 15.000 points with 3 deaths look lesser skilled than someone with 4.000 points and 16 deaths just because let's say one of those kills happened to come from the guy with more deaths?

 

[hleV]

So if kills don't count towards victory, meaning they mean nothing to the scoreboard, like you said, then why is the pro, according to the scoreboard, of lesser skill than a noob.

Also would you care to explain how does someone who has had let's say hypothetically 15.000 points with 3 deaths look lesser skilled than someone with 4.000 points and 16 deaths just because let's say one of those kills happened to come from the guy with more deaths?

Never have I said that the scoreboard indicates that noob > pro. Please give my posts two or three reads as apparently you're having a hard time grasping what I'm saying.

@vector, since you're still here replying in a thread I "hijacked", I'd like to point out that I will not bother arguing with complete idiots. In your previous post(s) you have proven to be one, with the newest one only proving this further. I suggest you not waste your time as the points you bring are worthless and will not be considered by me or any other sane person. If this doesn't go with you well, then feel free to continue writing, just don't expect your silly points not to be ignored.

 

[pumadace2000]

Never have I said that the scoreboard indicates that noob > pro. Please give my posts two or three reads as apparently you're having a hard time grasping what I'm saying.

Aha...

Because according to the scoreboard the pro is of lesser skill and the noob is of higher skill than they actually are.

Aha... higher skill means what exactly to you? And is reflected how on the scoreboard other than the amount of deaths and points scored?

Am I looking at some sort of quote from a book that is incomplete and has further explanations hidden somewhere?

Also how do you judge who actually is skilled an who actually is noob?

 

[hleV]

You haven't highlighted the most important part of the sentence you quoted. I could help you but you not being able to figure that out is too amusing.

 

[Enishi]

Since there is huge gap between pro and noob, deaths count should be removed from scoreboard in deathmatch and team-deathmatch mode. Only duel mode needs deaths count on scoreboard.

 

[pumadace2000]

You haven't highlighted the most important part of the sentence you quoted. I could help you but you not being able to figure that out is too amusing.

Let me pull a you here and completely ignore whatever you meant by actually are as I have no idea what kind of draconian system you use to decide who actually is pro and who actually is noob outside the scoreboard and I will also completely ignore the PL part because 1 it's not confirmed it works this way and 2 loosing PL screws over noobs more anyway because duh they die more.

So laugh until your belly turns red, I'll have a hard time hearing you over my symbolic laughing out loud of the fact that in the end you did show that you cared.

Since there is huge gap between pro and noob, deaths count should be removed from scoreboard in deathmatch and team-deathmatch mode. Only duel mode needs deaths count on scoreboard.

This was discussed. The community voted to keep a death counter, which for one, I agree with hlev that's bullshit. But the people have spoken. They want numbers that don't mean anything to the score. Almost like dying means a lot to them and... ooooooh.

 

[FalconFury]

Guys, you are going off topic. PLEASE stay on topic. AND PLEAAASE no trolling. You are making everyone here look stupid and yet, breaking the rules by following your "freedom of speech" of lack of knowledge. So please cool your ego, and don't feed the troll.


Just preventing you guys from getting warned and banned. If ya'll get banned then what else?

 

[hleV]

The original question of the topic was answered, so I believe it's fine to continue the sub-topic.

@puma, come back when you attain the ability to read and understand what you're reading.

Since there is huge gap between pro and noob, deaths count should be removed from scoreboard in deathmatch and team-deathmatch mode. Only duel mode needs deaths count on scoreboard.

Since that it out of question due to some community I'm unaware of having made a vote I'm unaware of, I'm trying to at least make the irrelevant-to-the-score stats more properly reflect players' skill levels in a skill-based game than they do now (by allowing luck to kill skilled players due to skilled players not being given an opportunity to do anything about it).